Dara Torres-Amazing

Look, we finally get a good hot topic and you want to quash the fun. This is legit conversation by folks who know the sport. Go back to planning your buffet for your meet if you don't like this. Personally, I find this interesting and am learning a lot about fast swimming. Maybe you should take note. I'm not quashing the fun...just saying name dropping and psuedo accusations are bit off. ..but hey, you're really serious about this thread...not. You're just deperate to draw me into a flame fest...your posts here alone prove that...maybe if you took the poster of me down from your locker and focused on techinique, instead of some latent, crush/envy of me as your motivator...you might beat Dara... :rofl::banana:

When Gary Hall is still going strong in 10 years...do the torches and pitchforks come out as well? Quicksilver.....since when did legitimate questioning of super human feats become "torches and pitchforks"? Tell me something...do you still have this same kind of sympathetic, none questioning trust in other areas of your life...perhaps in political views? Skepticism is a good thing.....personal attacks quite another so lets not blur the line. And by the way....Gary's been the subject of speculation here as well....insulin for diabetics possibly effect on performance as I recall....and just as fun as this thread.

Anyone else notice all it takes to get the Smith boys out of hibernation is a little dope (talking)? An eye witness account of quicky physical changes is something to consider, although not proof of anything.

Please forgive me not being clear. I simply raised the question that the test results would be interesting to say the least. And, if found that they were deceptive, perhaps additional scrutiny and drug testing to find out why they were deceptive in their answers. I do not have the answer to this very old problem that has ravaged sports over the years, I simply raised some questions and expressed what I feel or think would be interesting. At the very least, it would perhaps shed light on some areas that are rather gray at best. Lastly, I am not pointing my finger at Dara and I'm the last guy on earth who would want to see her or any other swimmer vilified without proof. Her swim last night raised a question or two in my mind for obvious reasons.

Dang it - busted again! I'll take down your picture and the caption underneath of your 2:46 200 SCY and try to find motivation elsewhere. Will be hard to turn my attention from the self-appointed Stud but I shall do my best to carry on with my shattered swimming life. LOL that's a PB! I'm damn proud of that swim! Never swam it before, did open turns, recovering from a stomach virus which cost me 7lbs the week before (sadly regained), and I had been competetive for all of 3 months...I am so ashamed I got up and swam something more than 50 BR. How many seconds do you think I will shave off next year at NEM? Will you accuse me of doping then too? Let's give me :02 per open turn back I'm already sub 2:30. It must be lonely at the acme of masters swimming there dude...:bow: If I break 2:25 I'll pose nude for you ;) Now stop disrupting the topic... :D

Gotcha.

Although I'd like to trust we're all competing clean, if they starting testing or wanting testing to prove it--it would kill the USMS scene. IMHO.

Does Dara look different,not that I've seen. She is essentially a professional athlete and has access to the most up to date training methods. My own experience is that with training as a relatively low priority my own times slowed little until my late 40s.I swam my 3rd fastest 50M BR at 46(though it was easier as I wasn't that fast in college,not a national qualifier or anything.)If I could do that with swimming a lower priority it seems a full time swimmer might be able to get a little faster than they were when younger.Maybe she is cheating,but her swims seem plausible to me.Maybe it was her suit(see fastskin pro thread.):dedhorse::dedhorse:

Skip, I read the articles and find some very interesting and compelling points he has made. The Spitz comparison is worth noting. Spitz couldn't make the comeback let alone final at nationals, and he had considerably more talent than Dara. Skip, I couldn't replicate or come close to my college times even if I did train full time. And don't go telling me that the sport has changed that much. That's a load of crap. If you take away the cheatin' suits, the cheatin' dolphin kick on backstroke, the cheatin' dolphin kick on pullouts and look at the 8th place time from nationals, it hasn't improved that much over the last quarter of a century. The 200 free is proof positive. Take a second away for the full body suit, and the event is only about a second and a half faster 25 years later. Note, I got 4th at NCAAs in 1984 and qualified for finals with a 1:35.89. 25 years later with a full body suit a 1:34 low will still get you into the top 8. I'm not impressed with the field....... only the winners. I don't think the sport has changed that much Skip....... I do believe there are more drugs and illegal supplements out there. Also, check your age on Rowdy. He's only about 4 years older than me. In 1988 I was 26. John Smith (an old and jaded man)

So, apparently you aren't really curious at all. To me, Spitz has a more impressive swimming resume and that leads me to believe he is or was or whatever more talented, in case you are curious. Debating who was better in different sports eras is one of the best things about sports, and sports bars, and beer. Woods/Nicklaus, Wilt/Russell, etc. ...but it's still just a matter of opinion...whether you know all the stats or are just drunk and annoying...