Please, help my butterfly stroke!!!

These times are good, congrats. If I was you (and if you are given the choice), I'd focus on improving the 12.5 for for all strokes. That - like I said earlier - includes making choices in how long you *dolphin kick* after butterfly dive. Bare in mind that if you want to give the crowd a *dolphin* show "a la Phelps", better make sure your kick is faster than your full stroke. Otherwise, you put yourself into a o2 deficit for no valid reason (especially during a 100). Test these matters over 12.5 Then, your 100s are a bit on the slow side. That suggests (maybe) that there's some room for improvement on the endurance side. Try to bring the 400 under 5, the 200 under 2:20, the 100fly near or under 1:15. You can all do that given that you pay enough attention to sets that put you out of breathe. All your event would benefit from a better ability to finish harder. Enjoy your swim Italian Fellow! Ciao

29.3 FreeStyle suggests a time under 32.0 for your 50m Butterfly. Keep nailing until you get there!! My best (are not olympic times): 50 freestyle - 29.10 short course, 29.80 long, 100 freestyle - 1.07.50 in long, 200 freestyle - 2.28.50 in short, 400 freestyle - 5.19.00 50 butterfly - 32.35 in short and 32.20 in long, 100 butterfly - 1.16.00 in short, 50 backstroke - 36.05 in short 100 backstroke - 1.25 in long 100 medley - 1.17.20 in short 50 breaststroke - 42.00 in short 3000 open water - 44.50 In order my prefered stroke to swim is, butterfly, backstroke, freestyle, individual medley and...breaststroke... I have yet to understand if I am a sprinter, a distance runner, butterflyers or freestyler or other but this year I would focus on a few specific races... what do you advise to do??? Thanks, I hope to not take too much of your patience and kindness. Easy :chug:

I have a question for those of us trying to just to increase their distance in the fly. i'd really like to put together a decent 50 fly so that i could eventually try and race a 200 IM. I have no problem making a 25, but once i have to make that turn, I can do a few decent strokes it all goes to pot so that i end up having to muscle most of the 2nd 25. I'm not sure if the best way to improve on this is just to: 1) continue muscling the second 25 2) go to 1-arm when i start falling apart, 3) work on 50s with fins or a pull bouy 4) do 25s with rest with enough rest so i can finish the 2nd 25. anyone been there and done that? :confused: thanks.

I have a question for those of us trying to just to increase their distance in the fly. i'd really like to put together a decent 50 fly so that i could eventually try and race a 200 IM. I have no problem making a 25, but once i have to make that turn, I can do a few decent strokes it all goes to pot so that i end up having to muscle most of the 2nd 25. I'm not sure if the best way to improve on this is just to: 1) continue muscling the second 25 2) go to 1-arm when i start falling apart, 3) work on 50s with fins or a pull bouy 4) do 25s with rest with enough rest so i can finish the 2nd 25. anyone been there and done that? :confused: thanks. I have a similar problem except my fall-off point is after 50yds/m. Things I have done in the past include: 1) sets of 50s with first 25 fly, second 25 free, working the dolphin kick off the turn. 2) sets of 50s with first 25 free, second 25 fly, trying to keep the first 25 solid but not race pace, then focus on maintaining good fly form on the 2nd 25. 3) swimming sets of 25 fly (4-20), start out with lots of rest for the first 2-6? (depends on conditioning), then reduce the rest incrementally. When form starts to break down, rest more and repeat when you're ready. 4) swimming lengths of 25s focusing on a relaxed easy glide to help pace longer swims. I don't have the guts to swim a 200 fly yet, but I can swim a nice slow one by gliding through the stroke. 5) swim sets of 25s just dolphin kicking, gradually work up to 50s, 75s then 100s. When I wear out it's usually my legs first, then that results in poor body position, which results in my arms and shoulders wearing out. Training my kick has helped reduce my times in both the 50 and 100 fly events. 6) screwy stuff - while swimming 100s & 200s free every so often I'll swim the last 25 fly to get a feel of swimming it while worn down. I'll push within reason, but do my best to maintain good form. I'm not a stroke purist in that I think a little bit of effort in the "sloppy zone" can be beneficial just to help conditioning for swimming whatever distance you want. Kind of like 2 steps forward, 1 step back. For me, achieving distance on fly is an incremental process. My :2cents::2cents: for what it's worth.

I have a similar problem except my fall-off point is after 50yds/m. Things I have done in the past include: 1) sets of 50s with first 25 fly, second 25 free, working the dolphin kick off the turn. 2) sets of 50s with first 25 free, second 25 fly, trying to keep the first 25 solid but not race pace, then focus on maintaining good fly form on the 2nd 25. 3) swimming sets of 25 fly (4-20), start out with lots of rest for the first 2-6? (depends on conditioning), then reduce the rest incrementally. When form starts to break down, rest more and repeat when you're ready. 4) swimming lengths of 25s focusing on a relaxed easy glide to help pace longer swims. I don't have the guts to swim a 200 fly yet, but I can swim a nice slow one by gliding through the stroke. 5) swim sets of 25s just dolphin kicking, gradually work up to 50s, 75s then 100s. When I wear out it's usually my legs first, then that results in poor body position, which results in my arms and shoulders wearing out. Training my kick has helped reduce my times in both the 50 and 100 fly events. 6) screwy stuff - while swimming 100s & 200s free every so often I'll swim the last 25 fly to get a feel of swimming it while worn down. I'll push within reason, but do my best to maintain good form. thanks funky. i think it is my kick that is killing me. even with fins, i'm a pretty pathetic fly kicker so that is a great suggestion. working the dolphin kick off of the wall is also something to work on. the pushoff sends me into the red zone where my sole focus becomes taking the next breath. i've never been opposed to muscling but i've critics of the practice say that it teaches you bad form.

Thanks guys, thanks SolarEnergy,thanks U.S.A. (I have "learn" to swim with Richard Quicks dvds) soon I will try to implement your advice, I will keep you informed if I get improvements. Good swimming and good races at all. Ciao, Easy

3) Arm recovery looks stiff as well, and it seems that they are coming out of the water way too high. If you can lower the arms to just barely clear the surface it should result in less energy being spent. Can't tell much, other than you're too vertical and arms are too high. We need some under water video. Good luck Hi guys, I have just returned from a swim training, I tried again the butterfly and I would ask one thing that has to do with the recovery too high. I have the sensation that the problem may be that I go too deep in the part after the catch ... not near the body, and when I recovery my arms fly too high, may be it? In the underwater phase, when the hands are near, in front of the chin, at what distance must pass close to the body? ... and I get to touch the thighs with the thumbs or exit earlier?? Thanks again and sorry for the inconvenience...:blush:

I have a question for those of us trying to just to increase their distance in the fly. i'd really like to put together a decent 50 fly so that i could eventually try and race a 200 IM. Interesting question. My only solution to this is to do all it takes to stop being feared by the distance. For me, it's the 200bf I prepare for. My solution was to develop a technique that is slow enough to use it to build a decent endurance base - at butterfly that is. And so, for few months, all I was doing in a pool was: 5x200 butterfly, no warm up no cool down nothing else. Now, I am not afraid at all by longish butterfly sets. The key is to cut down on energy expenditure. You have to accept though that endurance butterfly isn't a fast stroke. It's often better to start last swimmer in the lane on *specialty* (or at your choice) sets. I usually let the breaststrokers go first if I am to commit in a 400-1000m set. This approach is controversial though. A lot of folks think that if you practice slow butterfly, you will endup being slow even if you want to go fast. I disagree but I may be wrong.

The key is to cut down on energy expenditure. You have to accept though that endurance butterfly isn't a fast stroke. This approach is controversial though. A lot of folks think that if you practice slow butterfly, you will endup being slow even if you want to go fast. I disagree but I may be wrong. I'd love to be able to cut down on my energy expenditure. I'd be happy to swim a slow 50 fly. I think to swim a distance fast, you first have to be able to complete the distance. But, the stroke feels smoother when you swim it fast. Regardless of the speed, I've got good rhythm for the first 25 but the minute i make the turn, i'm so spent that no matter how hard i focus, i am thrashing about. Funky suggested doing lots of fly kick and i'm trying this along with doing lots of 1-arm.

I've been enjoying this thread. Last spring I managed my first 100 fly SCY, if slowly. I have been finding that the key for me is to lock my elbows on the stroke, lead with my face (into the water after a breath) and to breathe every other stroke. For me, butterfly has gone from seeming like a battle to becoming much more fluid. My endurance has improved, and I simply enjoy the act of swimming the stroke a great deal more. When done properly, it feels and looks like the most beautiful stroke of the four. People often talk about swimming the stroke "downhill", which resonates with me. Chest down as the arms sweep over. Vastly more efficient than trying to climb over the water with two arms as your butt sinks. Gruesome.