Dara Torres-Amazing

rofl::lmao

Most "illegal" substances have levels because they are naturally occurring in humans.Bill, Again, you appear to be confusing the law with enforcement. The WADA states that is “illegal” to take prohibited substances; this means taking any amount, period. There are only a couple of exceptions to this (for example alcohol) however none apply to swimming. A swimmer taking prohibited substances is performing an “illegal act”, it doesn’t matter if they are caught, the act is still illegal. So while all people have naturally occurring HGH, taking HGH is illegal. What you appear to be addressing is detection of these in blood or urine tests and not the taking. Note, an athlete can be banned for taking prohibited substances even if they never have a positive urine test, provided there are other means of proof. As for asthma medicines, some are always prohibited, some are allowed provided the athlete has a therapeutic exemption and some are only banned in competition. Athletes with asthma should work with their federation anti-doping to understand the rules. As for caffeine, WADA and FINA have no prohibition against caffeine, regardless of level in the blood or urine.

Oooh...that's cool...but probably would be called a training aid; how could you test? I can just see the IOC inspectors bursting into the athlete's home, rectal thermometers gleaming...

Bill, in the world of anti-doping the WADA list of prohibited substances and methods is rather explicit. For example, it is “illegal” to take any anabolic steroids, no matter how small the dosage. Taking prohibited substances (without a TUE) is never “not illegal”. No grey area in the law, only in the application of the law. Think of a driving analogy; it is “illegal” to drive 56 MPH in a posted 55 MPH zone (no grey area in the law), however the accuracy of speed detection devices and the randomness of police speed traps, embolden some to drive illegally. Again, not necessarily true. Most "illegal" substances have levels because they are naturally occurring in humans. They have to reach illegal levels to be considered illegal. Other drugs are not "illegal" if you need them for asthma. Caffeine isn't illegal, unless it reaches a high enough level to create an advantage. So your driving analogy is close. Driving 56 in a 55 is not illegal. An arrest officer still most prove your were wreckless. Wreckless driving is illegal. Here in Atlanta, they have determined that anything over 70 is automatically wreckless. Therefore 56-69 you are risk if other factors apply. Its a built-in gray zone that a court would decide.

SCYfreestyler, Perhaps you are right. Perhaps since Dara really never "owned" an event like the great ones she swam against which were her peers in the 80's and 90's. This is her way of "owning" her piece of history in the sport.... i.e. through longevity. Note, I say great in the sense of Tracy Caulkins, Mary T. or Janet Evans. John Smith I think this is an accurate analysis. She will be the Cal Ripken of swimming.

SCYfreestyler, Perhaps you are right. Perhaps since Dara really never "owned" an event like the great ones she swam against which were her peers in the 80's and 90's. This is her way of "owning" her piece of history in the sport.... i.e. through longevity. Note, I say great in the sense of Tracy Caulkins, Mary T. or Janet Evans. John Smith I am not sure if I agree with this. Not discounting what those 3 swimmers did but you have to remember that back in 1984, they did not have the 50 meter Free as an Olympic event. Dara held the World Record from January 1983 to August 1986, so we will never know what she was capable of doing in that event and its pure speculation weather she would have won the gold. Granted she did not make the team in the 50 in 1988 and 1992 but did in 1988 in the 100 Free. I will agree that she was not as good as say her American contempories during those time periods and beyond. But since 2000, I would say she compares on an equal basis with Jenny Thompson, Amy Van Dyken and Angel Martino. I believe with last weekends performance that she has equaled those 3 swimmers. Granted Jenny has more Olympic medals and Amy had one of the most successful Olympics with being the first American women to win 4 Gold medals in 1996 at one Olympics. And Angel winning 3 individual bronze medals in two Olympics. But Dara has 9 medals and has 3 bronze medals from individual events. That is equal to Angel and its one more in individual events than both Jenny and Amy. I not going to include relays because all of these swimmers practically swam together on relays and got the same medals. If you look at American Records Dara stacks up just as well if not better than the others. Jenny Thompson's American Record in the 100 Meter Free which was set as a World Record back in 1992 is still probably the most impressive. That :54.48 lasted 10 years as an American Record until 2002. She had the 50 Free Record for 2 years from 1992 to 1994 and then Amy had the record from 1994 until Dara got the record in 2000, which was broken last weekend and is 7 years and going strong. Angel Martino had the 50 Free record from 1986 to 1988 and had the 100 Free Record from 1991 until 1992. Dara Torres had the American Record in the 100 Meter Free Record from 1988 until 1991. Now if she can swim to 3 or 4 medals and win either one or two medals in some individual events then who is to say she is not one of the best USA swimmers ever. When you think of someone winning there first National Championship in 1982 and then doing it again twice in 2007, that is a 25 year spread and that feat is quite outstanding. Then to add to that being a member of 5 Olympic teams. That is something that will even be tough for Michael Phelps to accomplish if she makes it.

Rob: You are correct, I am referring to enforcement. In the pure sense, once an atlete takes an illegal substance, he haw committed an illegal act. But since athletes don't call themselves on it, testing and enforcement are the indicators of the honesty of the sport. Right now, cycling has a bad rap and deservedly so, but that doesn't mean all cyclist cheat. Then you look at baseball and you can figure that they all do it just to be competitive.

I have to say that if Dara is cheating, she has some incredible confidence and balls to deal with the scrutiny she faces already. She is practically inviting the drug testers into her life. Either she has the very best blood chemists working for her or she is clean. I believe there are cheaters who probably can beat most tests. Obviously many cyclists think they can. I just don't think the cheating game is so good that cheaters are confident enough to not fear tests at all. I believe Dara is clean and close to a freak of nature. I watched her 50M free win on Youtube and have to say her freestyle is a thing of beauty and power. He freestyle looks like the best of men, not any straightarm windmill like many women have. Dara's technique is beautiful. Combine perfect technique with optimized training and genetics and you have a winner.

Dan, You assume a lot of rational thought in the mind of a cheater. It's not all about weighing the risk for them, its about the winning, the ego, the acceptance, the public recognition......etc...... Is her freestyle stroke great...... hell yes. I could probably point out a few flaws in the race, but they are easily overcome by her upper body strength in her stroke. The issue was never whether she was or is talented. The issue on this thread is........... "the edge". I don't know..... sometimes I wonder what is to be gained by making 5 Olympic teams vs. 4 Olympic teams ? John Smith

I don't know..... sometimes I wonder what is to be gained by making 5 Olympic teams vs. 4 Olympic teams ? John Smith I can see what you are saying...you've made 4 what is one more, right? Well, I think more important than just making it onto another team is the fact that she will be doing so at the age of 41. The ability to span this period of time and still remain dominant in your speciality event is something to be proud of for sure.