The Butterfly Lane

Ok, I like that! I'll give it a try. Thanks! :) May take a look at this sequence of videos on the drills mentioned. On edit - dang it, this shows the 1 arm only, and is embedded. If you copy and paste, it'll go through the one arm, then take you to the 1-2-1 that Dan suggested. www.youtube.com/watch

Although I swam my fastest 100 fly in three years at the National Senior Games, "fast" is relative. I am still as slow as a turtle. Speed isn't as important to me as technique, though, so it's stroke technique feedback I am after. What can I still improve? Thanks, Forumites, for any constructive criticism you provide! www.youtube.com/watch

Kept that stroke together really nicely considering you were worried about the altitude! To be honest, I think you just need more "oomph," especially from your mid/lower body. The stroke pattern looks good, the timing looks good, you're doing underwaters, you're just not driving much with your legs - that includes off the start and turns too. Perhaps the answer is to work on your strength a bit. I would say, two things from a purely technique standpoint, first off, I think you need a bit more bend in your legs on the second kick to keep your feet from coming so far out of the water; secondly, gotta keep that front arm in the water on your turns - the mnemonic I was taught was "elbow your brother, call your mother" for the leading/trailing arms on open turns. Should be more of a vertical rotation - like a reverse flip turn - than a horizontal one.

Kept that stroke together really nicely considering you were worried about the altitude! To be honest, I think you just need more "oomph," especially from your mid/lower body. The stroke pattern looks good, the timing looks good, you're doing underwaters, you're just not driving much with your legs - that includes off the start and turns too. Perhaps the answer is to work on your strength a bit. I would say, two things from a purely technique standpoint, first off, I think you need a bit more bend in your legs on the second kick to keep your feet from coming so far out of the water; secondly, gotta keep that front arm in the water on your turns - the mnemonic I was taught was "elbow your brother, call your mother" for the leading/trailing arms on open turns. Should be more of a vertical rotation - like a reverse flip turn - than a horizontal one. Yeah, my first turn was more like my typical turn; however, when I got desperate for air, I allowed my arm to come out so I could catch more of a breath on those two other turns. :blush: Guilty as charged! I was much better at elbowing my brother and calling my mother in my breaststroke races! (He deserved it after all those childhood years of him beating up on me! :bitching:) As for bending my knees more on the second kick, I have improved over this past year, but not enough. My legs used to come out of the water at the top of my calves! I previously had much more of an up and down movement in my fly. Our forum moderator probably remembers that. :afraid: Strength. Yoga, Theraband, pushups, and planks have made parts of me stronger; however, you are right. I need more strength in my legs, especially quads and hamstrings. I will add that to my routine, because you're right; I'm lacking oomph! :weightlifter: I'm 57; however, I have seen plenty of gals older than me who are a lot stronger. Penny Noyes is 65 and a stud-ette! Thanks for the feedback JP; I especially appreciate the way you softened the blow with, "Kept that stroke together really nicely..." :wiggle:

That was beautiful! I am currently teaching myself the fly and can barely do a 25! I am fine until I breathe then my hips sink. I am still working on the rythm

That was beautiful! I am currently teaching myself the fly and can barely do a 25! I am fine until I breathe then my hips sink. I am still working on the rythm Are you referring to my fly in the video? If so, you are an :angel:. If not, then :blush:. Good luck with your fly! What really helped for me was this video: www.totalimmersion.net/.../betterfly-for-every-body.html Another big help was strengthening my back and shoulder muscles. Fly is a strength stroke! That is one of the main reasons why only 19 women across all age groups (of 480 women) competed in the 200 fly at the National Senior Games. (I didn't post my 200 fly video, because it would have put everybody to sleep!). You mentioned that your hips sink when you breathe. It could be that you are lifting your head up too high. When you breathe, lift your head only as high as necessary to get a breath, and try to push forward with your jaw rather than up. Watch a video of Michael Phelps, and visualize his breathing when you swim fly. Another reason your hips might be sinking is that you are recovering your arms too high out of the water. Again, watch Michael's stroke, and you can see he keeps his very low over the water. The key to being able to swim longer distances in fly is staying relaxed. The more I tense up, the more tired I get! If you post a video of your fly here on this thread, we can help you out by giving you some tips. Good luck! :cheerleader:

So, after being awol from the forum for over a yr--I return. My journey back to swimming came as I was dx. with pre-diabetes and a hiatus of >25 yrs from high school swimming. I joined Masters fall of 2017 and swam my first competitive event 3/2018. I added to the butterfly lane prior to this competition. I did fine in the 50 fly 28.84, but I did not finish in the 100 as I said I would. I was dying at the last 25 and I stopped--sad, I know. It took this time and tried different things (mainly breathing with every stroke vs every other) and this March (2019) I FINISHED 100 fly, but at a time that was okay--1:11.87. I say this as I did 1:11 in practice three days prior to the meet-from a push start. Regardless, I am pleased that I made progress and these past few months I have continued to work on my fly to the point that I signed up to do 100 LCM race next Sat. The issue now is that I am concerned that like a yr. before I may not finish the race. I have switched back to breathing every other as I am faster doing this. When I practice in scy I am okay doing it for 100. When I do it in LCM I am out of breath in the middle of second 50 (I am also overall beaten up and entering taper mode). I am trying to stay calm. My plan is to do every other breathing for 1st 50 and switch to every breath in the 2nd 50. As being a wk out I do not have time to build more endurance. Any thoughts besides the sage advice to take it slow for 1st 50 and glide as you can? Thank you

Well, I did not finish my 100 LCM fly. I did fine until around 75 m mark when I felt a tiny bit of fatigue and switched to breathing every stroke and in process took in some water and could not maintain my fly. So was d/q'd. A bit sad, but I learned from it. Was pleased with my 400 free time of 5:35 as I was expecting b/w 5:45 and 5:50. What I learned from this meet: 1) With fly you have to do the race distance in practice. Similar issue with me on 100 fly SCY. This March I conquered 100 SCY fly after being d/q'd March 2018. Good news is that I have motivation for completing 100 LCM next yr. 2) Race time in fly, at least for me, is similar time-wise to practice and is not true for my other three strokes (faster in race). 3) Re: 400 free, I was doing various pace based training with 5 to 10 sec rest, and that worked well for me (5 to 10x 100 LCM free on 1:35 secs, usually went b/w 1:25 to 1:30). Again my race time was better than expected. So, a little sad that I didn't finish my 100 LCM fly, but retain motivation for next yr. My goal is to more fly, trying to average 2k/week or ~400-500/practice (improving on 1.5k/wk and ~300-400/practice). I feel more fit compared to a yr ago, but I know there is significant room for improvement.

Dinicti, 100 Fly LCM can be a bit intimidating - especially that first breath off the wall and looking 50 meters down the pool. When I used to swim the 200 FLY (which was rare), I could never make the entire distance, so I would kick the 3rd 50. Yes, just kick. Keep your hands together, so you don't scull and lift your head to breathe. It is NOT fast, but it allows you to complete the distance legally. Completing the distance is really important in Masters because splits only count if the entire race is completed. An example of when it worked for a fellow swimmer back in 2017 at LC Nationals. This swimmer was trying to break the world record in the 50 fly by doing it during the 100 Fly. He did indeed break the WR in the 50 (27.85), took a couple of seconds at the wall to catch his breath, and then proceeded to kick 20-25 meters before returning to full stroke fly. While this got looks from the officials, it is perfectly legal. BTW - his final time was 2:03.23. You might keep this in the back of your head when you need a few moments to "rest" without your arms. :) Paul

Thanks, good to know, but hopefully will not need it for the 100 fly races. 200, well--no plans for me anytime soon--good of you to have done it (even rarely). I do admire Master swimmers doing the 200 fly or 400 IM, kudos to them. Meanwhile, I remain working on my fly 100 races. Take care