The Butterfly Lane

I think you would want to "down kick" b4 the "up kick"

Thank you for that explanation. That is exactly what I needed to know!:)

I would love to join the butterfly lane. I've been doing some dolphin kicks, single arm butterflies, but I can't transition to a proper butterfly. It feels like I am doing a belly flop.

OK I was DQ'ed at Nationals for "nonsimutamious arm recovery" I talked to the head judge about this cuz I was 5th place in my age group!! He explained that the other judge that filled out the dq sheet said my " left shoulder dipped lower than my right " What does this have to do with anything? I breathe on my right side like free on fly for years and have never heard of this before. Comments?

from the rule book: 101.3 Butter y 101.3.1 Start—The forward start shall be used. 101.3.2 Stroke—After the start and after each turn, the swimmer’s shoulders mustbe at or past the vertical toward the ***. The swimmer is permitted oneor more leg kicks, but only one arm pull under water, which must bring theswimmer to the surface. (Note: After the start and after each turn, only onebreaststroke kick is allowed prior to the arm pull that brings the swimmerto the surface.) It shall be permissible for a swimmer to be completely sub-merged for a distance of not more than 15 meters (16.4 yards) after the startand after each turn. By that point, the head must have broken the surface. Theswimmer must remain on the surface until the next turn or nish. From thebeginning of the rst arm pull, the body shall be kept on the *** exceptat the turn after the touch of the wall where it is permissible to turn in anymanner as long as the body is on the *** when leaving the wall. Botharms must be brought forward simultaneously over the water and pulledback simultaneously under the water throughout the race. since nothing can be perfectly simultaneous, its a judgement call ... but having one shoulder lower than the other does not appear to be referenced in the rule ... sorry to hear of the DQ ... did anyone capture a video of this?

Jack - thanx for the rule reference. I did talk the the head official and get the DQ voided after I showed him my side breathing style. Yes a video of the National meet is on line thru you tube and the meet. Day 3 - sat. at about 3 hours and 7 minutes in heat 3 lane 8. I do seem to lag my right arm BUT both hands enter and pull thru and exit the water at the same time. Shoulder drop is not a problem until it is past 90 on the *** , I would think. I asked him what to do in my 400 IM and 200 fly on Sun. and he replied if I get dq'ed see him to have it reversed. I think the official had not seen side breathing in us old swimmers and it looked "funny" so issued a DQ on me. Thankful the head guy reversed it for my 5th place at nationals!!! Glad the DQ was reversed. Congrats!

Jack - thanx for the rule reference. I did talk the the head official and get the DQ voided after I showed him my side breathing style. Yes a video of the National meet is on line thru you tube and the meet. Day 3 - sat. at about 3 hours and 7 minutes in heat 3 lane 8. I do seem to lag my right arm BUT both hands enter and pull thru and exit the water at the same time. Shoulder drop is not a problem until it is past 90 on the *** , I would think. I asked him what to do in my 400 IM and 200 fly on Sun. and he replied if I get dq'ed see him to have it reversed. I think the official had not seen side breathing in us old swimmers and it looked "funny" so issued a DQ on me. Thankful the head guy reversed it for my 5th place at nationals!!!

I would love to join the butterfly lane. I've been doing some dolphin kicks, single arm butterflies, but I can't transition to a proper butterfly. It feels like I am doing a belly flop. Total Immersion has a good video out to learn proper butterfly: "Better Fly For Everybody". www.GoSwim.TV also has good instructional videos. If you feel like you are doing a belly flop, I'm guessing you aren't getting your face back down in the water quick enough after your breath and before your arms come around on recovery. Good luck!

I do notice my right arm lags but, still the hands enter at the same time. Is the "above water" a dq-able technical point? It is. See what I wrote in the Nationals thread about this. That said I think the intent of the rule is that the arms shouldn't alternate. Your arms being slightly non-simultaneous is normally not going to get you DQed, I wouldn't think.

did look at the video ... from a distance, since you were the farthest away from the camera, it looked ok to me ... i think i saw were rich abrahams got dq'd in the 50 fly ... wonder if it was the same ref