How slow will they go (and what about us ...) ?

What do you think? Do you care if you get beat by a person in the lane next to you in a masters event if he is wearing a rubber body condom and you are only wearing jammers? I have done both - I swam Nationals in a non-rubber suit and probably lost a race beacuse of it and I have "used" the suits to break a few records. In a strange way, I was happy with both - At Nationals, I wanted an exact comparison to what I did in the previous year .. so you have to wear the same suit. Breaking the records, I am pretty convinced that the people in my age group are wearing the same suits (unless they are older records - and with Mike Ross around there not many of those ...). I do think the current suits should be allowed in Masters -- I know many people don't think it's a big deal, but I just hate shaving and being able to put on a suit in mid-season to go fast without shaving is really important. I think the Jaked / Arena suits are about a 2-3% difference up to the 200 distances. I would not be surprised, if nobody actually breaks 48 for the 100 Free until 2012. I also think, people saying that records don't add to the hype or popularity of a sport are way off base -- I could not tell any women's 200 track champions, but I sure know who is the "man" for the men.

..... I also think, people saying that records don't add to the hype or popularity of a sport are way off base -- I could not tell any women's 200 track champions, but I sure know who is the "man" for the men. ehoch, Yes, but can you even remember even half the the names or people that set the 100+ World Records the last 2 years. The vast majority of these names seem to just slide into oblivion after their own records got broken again and again..... so many times in one year. I'm serious when I say, I stopped looking at my blackberry email updates from swimming world last year with the new world record announcements. It just got to be kind of joke. As for women's track champions...... Are you really watching them that closely? Their sport appears to be pretty dirty to me. ".... always look at track and field - especially the women's events. They now have a much cleaner sport. It was not even technology, it was PEDs causing all these ridiculous world records -- so fans should be more excited to have great performances by (hopefully) clean athletes. But I am not watching track any more -- I don't want to watch the women's long jump winner failing to clear 7 meters. The men's high jump has been at the same height for 25 years. By the way - does anybody think Usain Bolt is clean ? I would bet anything that he is not ..... "

A swimmer does not have to carry their own body weight - the amount of strength for one arm pull is so small comapred to what you need for a stride of running. Go right ahead - ask any runner to complete an equal to a college swim training program while running --- 60k in the water = about 240 k a week running. A marathon a day - no problem. And during hell week - they will do one in the morning and one in the evening :applaud: Ok - what is "new" in running in the last 20 years ? Bolt runs exactly like Carl Lewis - he is just taller. But water is six times more dense than air (IIRC my HS science), so it is more difficult to move through - also swimmers derive vastly more locomotion from their arms/upperbody vs legs and a runner derives vastly more from their legs ( a muscle mass many times greater than the upper body) - think of weight lifting, I can only bench at best 150 lbs, but can squat or leg press 300 plus, but I think my swimming time in a 100 would be faster (if there was a reliable conversion) than if I tried a 100 on the track. I don't know many runners, but those that I have known really never did the amount of training I did as a swimmer when I look back on it. The exception are cross country or long distance runners - sprinters never. Also we never really thought to to compare it and factor in tghe impact of not breathing 50% or more of the time. New in running is probably training methods, not so much "running" - Bolt runs flat out fast, but that is what he is built to do, no different than a lot of swimmers who are 50 and 100 sprinters - Lewis was also an excellent long jumper and probably have been a good decathlete (the shot and discus may have been weaker events). Bolt is to sprint track events what Ricky Henderson was to base stealing, some day both records will fall because someone will always become better, faster, and more capable.

I roomed with track guys in college. One was a 440 guy, another was a hurdler, and the last chap was a pole vaulter. None of them put in the training time I did. They most certainly spent more time in the weight room than I did. Technique was a huge part of their training. We had many arguments as to the tougher sport. I would bring up the limited breathing aspect, they would bring up the fact that I could float when done with my event, and not fall to the ground like a cut puppet. I would argue time in training, they would argue training smart. I would argue that swimmers must start young to be competitive, they would suggest talent must be present to be a winner in track. I called the three of them and asked their take on Bolt's runs. They all said "Dirty". Oh, two of my above roomies were taking steroids supplied by the team trainer. We knew that it was cheating, but....

We had many arguments as to the tougher sport. I would bring up the limited breathing aspect, they would bring up the fact that I could float when done with my event, and not fall to the ground like a cut puppet. float at the end of a race??? I'm not sure how that argument even fits - when you say it out loud it sounds so ridiculous. So when they finish a sprint or a 440 they don't stop, they run forever, or somehow floating allows us to immediately recover?? Both running and swimming are a lot about learning to pace your race properly - but I still see swimming in a medium that is more dense, and using a less powerful set of muscles (maybe slightly so) is harder if you have a comparible distance/workout/time.

How many world records were set in the World track championships? I watched a lot of it and harldly heard world records mentioned - except of course for Bolt and he will be athlete of the year and go down as one of the greatest ever in track and field for breaking world records. ...The argument that you need to break a bunch of world records to make a sport watchable is garbage. It doesn't even seem like the world class swimmers care as long as the field is level.

... just looking at people naked or looking at their chromosomes might not tell you everything you need to know to assign people to categories. But, it works about 99.99% of the time so it's a damn good starting point.

But, it works about 99.99% of the time so it's a damn good starting point. Well, sure. For my purposes in life, it has even always worked out fine for the test subject to stay clothed. Ambiguities are pretty rare, and have never turned out to be important. But I am not running a world championship track meet.

But water is six times more dense than air (IIRC my HS science) No, you recall incorrectly. Try close to 800 times as dense.

Practice in the pool how you want to finish, not the way the swimmer in front of you slows or stops too early !