If they go back to true regular suits and Jammers, we may never see the times of the last 2 years again - well at least not until they change the rules again.... I went back to look at the World Rankings for 10th Place and 25th place for the last 7 Olympic years. The Olympic years have always been the fastest years (except of course for 2009 - thanks to you know what). I used the 10th and 25th spot to avoid the "freak" factor and good a good average rate of improvement. Also - I used Freestyle to avoid the impact of rule changes and the emergence of dlphin kicks.
1984 50.36 50.93
1988 50.13 50.54
1992 49.83 50.43
1996 49.74 50.27
2000 49.15 49.67
2004 49.08 49.45
2008 47.83 48.5
2009 47.77 48.27
A couple of things jump out:
- rate of progress has slowed down to maybe 1 to 2 tenth per Olympic cycle
- Big drop in 2000 with arrival of Fastskin suits - about half a second ! and of course a full second and more in 2008.
- In a 1996 suit, I would guess the current times to be just a little slower than the 2000 times.
They are going to have trials next year for the 2011 Worlds - I am guessing a 49.7 or 49.8 will make the US team in the 100 Free ....
you folks that think every human fits neatly into the "man" or "woman" box (no pun intended) need to pack up the jalopy and take a drive to the big city once in a while.
Yeah, we realize people might cross-dress or even surgically alter their physically sexual characteristics, but unless I'm mistaken you still can't genetically alter one's sex.
I'm going to roll the dice and predict a 48 mid without the technology.
48 mid for the winner or to make the team ? Popov did a 48.21 in 1994 - all times faster than that were done in some form of full body suit. Here are the results from the 2006 nationals in Irvine -- I think the 2006 full body suits add about half a second -- people should have gotten a little faster, but not half a second - so times should be slower than this ...
1. 5 LEZAK Jason 75 NOVACA 0.70 22.97 48.63
2. 6 WALKER Neil 76 TXLAST 0.78 23.24 49.23
3. 4 JONES Cullen 84 NCSTNC 0.72 23.87 49.35
4. 3 WILDMAN-TOBRINER Benjamin 84 STANPC 0.69 23.35 49.39
5. 2 WEBER-GALE Garrett 85 TXLAST 0.66 23.22 49.46
6. 8 KELLER Klete 82 CW-MI 0.81 23.86 49.81
7. 1 BRUNELLI Nicholas 81 SDA-AZ 0.66 23.37 49.84
8. 7 RITTER Adam 85 FORDAZ 0.74 23.87 49.88
A swimmer has to propel their body through water, not air. I don't think you can categorically state that you need more pure strength and power for track.
A swimmer does not have to carry their own body weight - the amount of strength for one arm pull is so small comapred to what you need for a stride of running.
Impact on the body is much bigger? Again, where's the data to support that?
Go right ahead - ask any runner to complete an equal to a college swim training program while running --- 60k in the water = about 240 k a week running. A marathon a day - no problem. And during hell week - they will do one in the morning and one in the evening :applaud:
Running technique not complicated? Cmon, man, that's patently untrue. It's a hyper technical sport like swimming also.
Ok - what is "new" in running in the last 20 years ? Bolt runs exactly like Carl Lewis - he is just taller.
you folks that think every human fits neatly into the "man" or "woman" box (no pun intended) need to pack up the jalopy and take a drive to the big city once in a while.
In what regard? Participation? TV rankings? What country? Cite your sources please, just curious, not arguing.
I would say the the level of tv coverage for T&F in europe is really high. the golden league is on tv every friday night during the season.
I've only ever been able to watch swimming World cup via livetiming.
in sweden swimming only makes the news when its an international meet or our nationals. but they talk about the runners and jumpers all year long.
"I think the 2006 full body suits add about half a second "
I would presume a Jaked compared to an old style classic speedo brief (which I think is more relevant or perhaps even a compared to a jammer) is worth a good second per 100 depending on body type. I would think the top two places in the 100 free (i.e. to make the team) would need to go 48 mid next year. That's a straight up comparison to the suits of the old days with Biondi and Rowdy. Probably a 49 low to squeak in to finals for eighth place next year. Who knows.... but it is interesting to see that the times really haven't improved all that much over 30 years after you take away the technology and keep the strokes the same.
Running and swimming comparisons only go so far. I mean even the swimmers who are sprinters (50/100 free) are capable of training 100 times their race distance a day (10,000). Runners will never approach this.
It will be interesting to watch Alain Bernard's last 20 meters of his 100 next year without the magic suit. I have seen large heavy bricks sink.
Why does track allow 1 false start & charge ALL?? Do as we do & kick the twitcher out for that event !!
IAAF is phasing in zero tolerance for false starts in the next year or two.
If y'all have an American IP address, Universal Sports online is carrying the British feed of the WC meet, and it's infinitely better coverage than what Vs. has been showing, especially for the field events.
ehoch,
The "what about us" portion of your thread.
I have voiced my opinion on this forum about the rubber suits and vote for keeping them as a choice for masters swimmers. I don't think it's as important an issue when it comes to masters swimming vs. USA swimming and many masters swimmers like them a lot.
What do you think? Do you care if you get beat by a person in the lane next to you in a masters event if he is wearing a rubber body condom and you are only wearing jammers?
This is really difficult to explain how someone can compete in the world championships without this issue being resolved prior to the competition
I am soooo tired of nobody being to able to stop this kind of stuff from happening ...
Why don't they settle this prior to the meet ?
Why is Jamaica all over sudden the sprint mecca of the world and everybody is celebrating the "head clown"?
Why do we have to look at a women's 400 dash record from an athlete where I can tell you the doping regimen she was under (or 100 or 200 or 800 or Long Jump or ....) ?
ehoch - you failed to post any data, just opinions, which is fine. But, don't pass your opinions as some sort of technical fact. Just because a running style is similar in no way means there aren't significant technical skills required, just ask any top level runner, as you like to point out.
If you are a bad technical runner you will not be competitive. If you want proof, just go to any 10K, half or full marathon any weekend of the year.
