Do we have it (training) all wrong?

Paul is that all he does or is there biking, and weights etc? Like you said get fit out of the water and save it for the race pace stuff and drills etc. No 4k a night thing. Admitted I am not a swimmer thru school and college but I got fast (for me :50's down to 28 low; 100 1:06ish converted) at 50's and 100's doing little else but 2.5 -3kyards x 3 a week. Of note my 2 BR went from #;07 to 2:57 in 1 season... of course I's a nice steep curve of improving times when you first start up. I think you may be able to get some relative drops doing pure sprint work and technique stuff. Provided you don't binge eat and balloon up your weight etc. This year I'm dong 3k x 4 or 5 a week in the LCM pool. I look a tad faster than last year, but the test will be zones in 3 weeks...see if I get any good drops after a rest and taper.

So much of what swimmers do is just superstition. Yes, we must train twice a day for several hours! www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/.../2020277 I'll offer some of the workouts I've done this summer in the style Paul is talking about. 8x25 free with fins @ 1:00 48 strokes free from a dive with board shorts (open water) 3x25 fly with fins @ 3:00 I'm sorry, this is not a workout nor adequate preparation for any distance unless you are competing against 8/9s in the 25 Summer League. This is in no way similar to what Paul is proposing. If all you do is the 50 and you have no desire to get better or do longer distances, this might suffice but as you get older and consider doing other distances this will cause you to fall flat on your face.

First let me begin by saying, I’m in. I will evaluate what I would call the “Increased Stress through quality vs., quantity workouts) at our state meet in about nine months. If you follow basic baseline training, your workout times will dictate if you’re adapting to stress. When stress adaptation is realized (times not improving) you’ll need to find ways to add effective stress (stress that produces positive gains) to your workouts. Dara Torres won both the 100 and 50 while decreasing the yardage she did during her peak training decades ago, by half. I think Torres proves that there’s more ways to skin (adding stress and improving performance) a cat than simply adding yardage to a workout. There’s an interesting article (on this subject) by Genadijus Sokolovas, Ph.D. USA Swimming Coaches Quarterly, The Science and Art of Coaching USA Swimming, The article doesn’t answer your question but does bring up an important note about the importance of stress adaptation. The article simply states that increasing workloads are necessary for improvement. I think coaches and swimmers who only use yardage as a stress gaining tool are missing the boat. I think athleticism is a tough card to trump and should become a swimmer and coach’s main focal point. Increasing general athleticism and specific (swimming) athleticism are two different things. Core strength and symmetrical strength (fourteen concentric and eccentric muscle exercises) is what I can general strength. Isometric and resistance exercises that improve EVF, streamlining, kicking and pulling are what I call specific strength. Like Dara Torres, I will concentrate on becoming a better athlete with general strength and specific strength. I will also add a little running and biking to help the cardio. I will get in the water in the second week in September and try to get three swim workouts a week and each session will be no more than 1500 yards. I injured my rotator-cuff in February and haven't been in the water since.

I'm sorry, this is not a workout nor adequate preparation for any distance unless you are competing against 8/9s in the 25 Summer League. This is in no way similar to what Paul is proposing. If all you do is the 50 and you have no desire to get better or do longer distances, this might suffice but as you get older and consider doing other distances this will cause you to fall flat on your face. Geek....Brian did throw down a really good 50 in Austin (21.04) and that seems to be his focus....so would this type of training along with a heavy emphasis on weight training possibly be what someone like track sprinter Asafa Powell or Usain Bolt would do? Were talking about guys training to run in the 9.7 range...and MAYBE pushing out to 200m (19.32)? As for the board shorts...sounds funky but I still know guys that train with them...and don;t forget doing funky stuff like kicking with sneakers (Josh Davis mentioned this in Austin but people have done it for years). This type of resistance/power work along with and including chutes, bungee's, power racks, etc. all blow your HR thru the roof...something most swimmers rarely can do in workout. FYI...I had some swimmers from Sun Devil stay after workout the other day to do some bungee work...all were mainly 50-200 folks and I thought we might have a heart attack they were so 'blown up".

I mentioned the current issue of Bicycling magazine earlier and several great articles along the same lines, here's a few samples: "Dead Zone Syndrome = typically found in the time-crunched, who often feel that every moment on the bike is so precious that they must go hard." "Symptoms + Those suffering from the malady may not be aware of it, due to the syndrome's insidious nature. That's because, at a minimum, it maintains fitness." "You're sweating, you burn calories and you get good endurance out of it." "It typically manifests itself in the summer, after the body has reaped much training benefit as possible from single-zone riding. it can manifest as a feeling of monotony, both physical and psychological. Moderate-level intensity provides a constant stimulant to your sympathetic nervous system, your 'fight or flight' response so if you're stressing that system to the same degree day-to-day, there'll be less recovery. In other words you're wearing yourself down." Sounds like 90% of the masters swimmers I see and 99.9% of the folks at the gym everyday on the elliptical! The article goes into detail on a 16+5 plan (16 days of "on" training in all 5 training zones followed by 5 days of recovery). Interesting

I've been back in the water after a six year hiatus and have been training kind of like the track workouts Paul described. I'm convinced I was overtrained in high school and college and could have swum faster. I lift hard a couple of times a week, but only swim about 2,500 in 4-5 swim workouts a week. I do zero 'garbage' yardage. After a short warm-up, I do lots of dolphin kicking with fins specifically to work on SDK off the walls and strengthen my core. I do stroke drills trying to get the hang of EVF. Then I do some sprints and warm down. With just a few days rest, my times in the 50 LCM free and fly would have been 3rd and 4th in the 40-44 age group last year, so I'm pretty happy with my progress. Now, I haven't even tried racing 100s LCM yet. They might be beyond terrible. But I think training like this is fun. I also train on my own, so I just wouldn't tolerate 10X200 or anything like that. I'd simply get bored and get out before finishing such a set.

So much of what swimmers do is just superstition. Yes, we must train twice a day for several hours! www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/.../2020277 In an effort to assess the contributions of a period of increased training volume on swimming performance, two matched groups of collegiate male swimmers were studied before and during 25 wk of training. For the first 4 wk of this study, the two groups trained together in one session per day for approximately 1.5 h.d-1. During the following 6 wk (weeks 5-11), one group (LONG) trained two sessions per day, 1.5 h in the morning and 1.5 h in the afternoon. The other group (SHORT) continued to train once each day, in the afternoon with the LONG group. Over the final 14 wk of the study, both groups trained together in one session per day (1.5 h.d-1). Although the swimmers experienced significant improvements in swimming power, endurance, and performance throughout the 25 wk study, there were no differences between the groups. However, during the 6 wk period of increased training, the LONG group experienced a decline in sprinting velocity, whereas the SHORT group showed a significant increase in sprinting performance. The test results suggest that a 6 wk period of two 1.5 h training sessions per day does not enhance performance above that experienced with a single training session of 1.5 h each day. It was also noted that both groups showed little change in swimming endurance and power after the first 8 wk of training, though their performances improved significantly after each taper period. I'll offer some of the workouts I've done this summer in the style Paul is talking about. 8x25 free with fins @ 1:00 48 strokes free from a dive with board shorts (open water) 3x25 fly with fins @ 3:00

The article goes into detail on a 16+5 plan (16 days of "on" training in all 5 training zones followed by 5 days of recovery). That sounds brutal. I feel like I need a day off after more than about four consecutive days.

So much of what swimmers do is just superstition. Yes, we must train twice a day for several hours! www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/.../2020277 I'll offer some of the workouts I've done this summer in the style Paul is talking about. 8x25 free with fins @ 1:00 48 strokes free from a dive with board shorts (open water) 3x25 fly with fins @ 3:00 JH but you do a lot else. So you think if one did your interesteing routines as part of their routine it would have the ame efect. Or do you think it's the absence of other swimming e.g. slower paced distance etc that makes it work?

That sounds brutal. I feel like I need a day off after more than about four consecutive days. Kirk..good point about wether track is something we should want to emulate. I just think we (swimmers) are far to much into routine and more importantly so many people (especially middle distance-distance) won't do quality speed work. i can't tell you how tired i get coaching of hearing someone say "I only have one speed"!! As for the 16+5.... cycling is far less "stressful" on the body in general than swimming and running. Also, remember that I said and the article explains in detail that these 16 days encompass 1ll 5 zones...which include recovery rides for 30 minutes in zone 1 (or even day off) for example...when you get to the 5 days of recovery however its 1 day off, 1 day recovery ride, 1 day off, 1 day zone 1 w/optional cadence spin ups and finally 1 day off....then repeat. The key to me and relating to swimming is that you really need to change things up almost daily in your effort level and that means recovery is a regular part of training as is speed work.