Ok, so the more they email me, the more I get nervous about the water temp. Last year it was 69 which stung to get in, but it made for a nice swimming temp. By the end, though, my fingers and toes felt a little numb, but that could have been tired (??).
But this year, it could be up to 10 degrees colder?! What to do when the coolest water I can find here in Cincinnati is 80?
Former Member
In high school, I once pulled a 100 fly time to place in the top 3 in the district meet when I'd never before swum anything that would have placed in the top 12.
The claim has been made that Andy swam 50x100's on 1:10 in LCM (not directly by Andy, it is possible that Chris meant something else or was reporting inaccuaretly). That set DID NOT happen.
Lenoard: someone cheating or more likely getting confused is really as likely as alien abductions? Really?
There are definitely some swimmers who really excel in open water. For example, Alan Bell has beaten me several times at the Fat Salmon swim in Seattle, despite the fact that I'm faster in pool swims. For example in Clovis I went 17:07 in the 1650 and he went 18:28. He didn't swim Fat Salmon this year, however.
There are definitely some swimmers who really excel in open water. For example, Alan Bell has beaten me several times at the Fat Salmon swim in Seattle, despite the fact that I'm faster in pool swims. For example in Clovis I went 17:07 in the 1650 and he went 18:28. He didn't swim Fat Salmon this year, however.
Excellent example. Thanks so much Kirk. I knew some people were much better in OW. I did not realize that there was that much of a difference however.
Absolutely, Kirk. I get beat by guys in OW that I beat handily in the pool. However, I still contend that it is VERY RARE for a person to go a faster pace in OW than they go in the pool. The guys who beat me in OW just slow down less from the pool than I do.
I noticed the fastest time ever in the USMS 5K Postal event (long course meters in a pool) is 58:11 by Jeff Erwin. The record in the 50-54 age group is 1:00:53 by Jim McConica.
Lifeguards should not be officiating a race they are there for safety only. Official race referees should be posted on the inside corner at every turn, especially at a USMS National Championship, were they? If you are depending on a lifeguard to track either a inadvertant or deliberate cutting of a corner your asking too much. To actually see the swimmers number they would likely have leave there post and paddle up close to the swimmer to record there number. Plus turning an 18 year old lifeguard into the judge that determines yea or nea at National event would not go over very well with me.
Name, Pace per 100 for the 1650, pace per 100 at Big Shoulders.
I think you've got the second and third columns reversed here (edit: OK, lefty fixed this). And, of course, one column is pace per 100 yards and the other is pace per 100 meters. On a percentage basis, here's how much slower each of these swimmers' pace was at Big Shoulders than in their best 2009 1650: 3, 21, 21, 17, 15, 15, 15, 17, 13. Purely based on the difference in length between yards and meters the expected difference would be 9%.
Come on Kirk(!) you know better than that. When Alan Bell beat you last year you averaged 25:35 per mile. This year you averaged 22:57 per mile. You used this years mile times, and last years race results. All things being equal Alan Bell cannot beat you in an open water swim
Last year's event was against a headwind, though, so everyone was slower. Yeah, it's too bad he didn't swim this year for a better comparison. Anyway, I'm not sure I agree with your conclusion. Alan has beaten me enough in open water that it can't just be a fluke!
Guys, I do agree that Seibt's result is remarkable, but it certainly isn't impossible. Just think of Bob Beamon's long jump in the 1968 Olympics. He jumped 8.90 meters (29 ft 2.5 in.). His career best jump before this was 8.33 m (27 ft 4 in)! Yes, I realize there were lots of factors contributing to this jump, but the fact remains that sometimes seemingly impossible athletic achievements do happen.
I am not trying to be a jerk here: I am either completely misinformed or this claim is patently false. In this very thread the set was 50x100's on 1:15 in yards. Now it is 50x100's in on 1:10 meters?
There is 14 years of data on Mr. Seibt in the top 10 data base. His "graph" looks just like everyone else’s. 14 years ago he was doing 1000 yard frees in 10:24. We have a 10:36 9 years ago, and a 10:51 this year. These are very respectable times, but hardly world class. But now, after 14 years, he is putting up a set that Micheal Phelps would have trouble with (for the record I think Phelps could do 50x100's on 1:10 but he sure wouldn't look forward to it). What is the explanation for this? Hanging back for 14 years?
It is not going out on a limb to say that any swimmer with a 14 year track record similar to Mr. Seibt’s cannot do 50x100's on 1:10 in LCM in a practice setting ( or any setting). I think more than 3x100s would be a struggle at that pace. So can we get some clarification, Chris? What was the specific claim? And would it bother you if you find out that some of the evidence you were given was wrong or exaggerated?
This thread is beginning to fascinate me. As a distance swimmer I would estimate that Mr. Seibt's database pool times do not match his recent open water swim in the least. Perhaps we could have some other distance swimmers comment on this phenomenon? In reading the race director's comments, I have more questions now than before. I am not questioning Mr. Seibt's great feat or his win. I am, however, trying to determine the mechanics behind a masters swimmer going from an 18:05 in the mile; 11:00 in the 1000; 5:12 in the 500 to the 5K OW time and to doing 50x100 meters @ 1:10.
Seriously, how do you pull off a several minute cheat in an OW race like this and given all the investigation into the matter?
Well only doing one lap of the two would do the trick too.
