As an "outsider" to the world of "hardcore" swimming ...
Former Member
I swim a lot and really enjoy it. It's something I've done all of my life, growing up in Southern California, and it's my main form of exercise. I'm good at it, but I do it primarily for health and enjoyment.
I've noticed from lurking around this board for several years that there seems to be a very self-congratulatory, cliquish tone to many threads and posts. It seems like it's often a small group of people who post relentlessly, as if they are engaged in some sort of private conversation where they're trying to outdo each other.
Maybe I'm the only one who feels that way. Maybe that's part and parcel of the world of "hardcore" competitive swimmers. Or maybe it's because there wouldn't be anything else to talk about, unless there weren't a constant focus on who's the "best" at this or that.
A race is something that happens once in a while, whereas a lifetime of swimming lasts, well, a lifetime. Yes, it's great to break a certain time in a certain race, but it's also great to have the self-discpline to keep at a daily swimming program and work on improving one's technique and endurance. Both are valid, and, to my mind, neither is more worthy of praise than the other.
Jim Thornton, if I recall correctly, noted a while ago that there were a lot of people lurking around the board and not really participating. If that is the case, I would propose that may be due to the general off-putting tone of things on here. (I won't give examples at this point, although I could.)
BTW, speaking only for myself, fitness/health is my main reason for swimming too. It's just that competition is a way to motivate me to be in better shape than otherwise. There is no question that I am fitter than I would be if I never swam in meets, though others obviously may differ in what motivates them to work out.
Agree 100%. Maybe I'm not self-motivated enough, but I find that, if I don't have some event to train for, my desire to get up at 4:30 in the morning to get a workout, dog walk, kids ready for school, etc. in before work wanes very quickly.
There is certainly a social aspect too; there are a lot of people I see at meets, or friends I've made, that I see nowhere else. And occasionally there is a blast from the past: I've unexpectedly come across old friends or teammates. At Worlds in 2006, I saw my swim coach from when I was a 14-year-old in Greece, which was pretty cool and totally a surprise.
It goes even beyond friends to family and even professional lives. Two examples:
My dad and I (he's 65, I'm 41) live on opposite sides of the country and both swim Masters. This year I've met him and my Mom in both Austin and New Jersey for swim meets. Hanging out with them over three days through 7 to 8 hour days at the pools, followed by dinner and more discussion is a TREAT I'm glad we're able to give each other.
Like Chris's example from Worlds in 2006, I was introduced via a swimming colleague to a guy who was in the market for a new role professionally. While I ultimately couldn't make the package from my company match the offer he had elsewhere, this is one person that I hope one day I'll be able to work with outside of the pool.
I've had a discussion going on with a fellow swim parent at my kids' team around this question, "Does swimming produce great people or are great people attracted to swimming?" At the end of the day, it doesn't really matter as the end result is the same.
From time to time, people might get cranky on the forums ... but isn't that true in real life, as well?
One quick non-jokey thought here. It's actually the truly great swimmers like Chris Stevenson, Ande Rasmussen, Pat Brundage that are the nicest people on these forums.
It's us aspiring types like me and Paul Smith, whose lives outside of swimming are mediocre and unsatisfying, who are problematic.
Avoid us and you will find the forums uniformly welcoming.
Actually, I am pretty nice too. Just avoid Paul if for no other reason that the federal marshals will eventually find him, and just like they did with Gordon Caul, they will fire so much lead into his home that the walls will collapse under the weight of it. You don't want to get caught in the crossfire. Even a triple coating of B70s will not be enough to save you.
It gave the regulars a chance to yuck it up amongst themselves--once again. Sigh.
And what the f is wrong with that, Mr. HTT? Stop with the whiney "sighing." Ugh. Or don't; it's your perogative.
I have no problem with an "outsider" thread. Splendid idea. By why does it merit a special "sticky" unlike any other thread exactly? Just revive the thread whenever necessary as people do other threads. I may have to go revive my "Women's Locker Room" thread just reading this.
Indeed, I recall that you are such a jolly fellow, that you had the following to say about posters on a completely innocent thread (masters horror flick) lampooning forumites:
".. but before she could see what it was an asteroid the size of the North American slammed into the Earth, immediately destroying all civilizations and life on it and knocking the globe off its orbit, whereupon Earth plummeted into the Sun, which permanently incinerated and vaporized all traces of Earth and anything ever associated with it, including but not limited to all of the people, places, and things referenced in this thread, which people, places, and things could never be reconstructed, resurrected or reconstituted by any power, force, or method, whether known or imaginary."
Seriously, if you harbor such a dim view and have such an avid dislike of the posters here, why bother reading? And, for the second time, no, you will not turn into a "turnip" because you are not competing. But there is no reason to belittle people that are competing or that obsess about it. That is our choice too.
A race is something that happens once in a while, whereas a lifetime of swimming lasts, well, a lifetime. Yes, it's great to break a certain time in a certain race, but it's also great to have the self-discpline to keep at a daily swimming program and work on improving one's technique and endurance. Both are valid, and, to my mind, neither is more worthy of praise than the other.
Sftom,
While I know there's a lot of discussion around racing and times, I think, at the core, most people are on the forums and in USMS for a variety of relatively similar reasons -- staying healthy, camaraderie, setting fitness goals (whether time / ranking related or not) and then figuring out how to achieve them. Times and rankings are an easy shorthand and ONE way to measure "success," but I think most people are digging deeper than that.
I agree there are a number of very prolific posters ... but you'll also find great advice (& not just racing advice) from these folks (as well as others). Hang out, check out the threads and topics that are of interest to your particular path right now and then jump in ... the water's fine and there are (little to no) sharks biting.
People here like to talk about successes in training and competitions because they know they'll have a receptive ear. This is something as swimmers we might not get at home or among non-swimming friends.
sftom - is this the first Internet forum you've joined? It seems like you're complaining about their very nature. Cliques, flames, trash talking... these are sine qua non for discussion boards. This one is actually pretty tame and welcoming. And on-topic. The moderators actually moderate.
People here like to talk about successes in training and competitions because they know they'll have a receptive ear. This is something as swimmers we might not get at home or among non-swimming friends.
This is certainly true! It took my loving family 18 months to resume talking to me once I acquired a swim coach ("What is she doing THAT for?!")
"sftom," a lot of the conversations on these forums are continuations of conversations happening off the forums, at meets and elsewhere, as people get to know each other in person (I don't swim at that level, but I think it's kind of fun to drop in on long-running movies that don't star me, LOL!). And the amount of work to shave maybe a second off a time -- which generally indicates an overall increase in fitness, and improved technique -- is extraordinary.
Posters have been very generous with me, giving me lots of tips and plaudits for trifling achievements, such as a first dive after 40 years.
Any bb develops its own personality, and a few posters will lead the convos for a time. Bring your goggles, pull up a chair, and join in!
:)
A race is something that happens once in a while, whereas a lifetime of swimming lasts, well, a lifetime. Yes, it's great to break a certain time in a certain race, but it's also great to have the self-discpline to keep at a daily swimming program and work on improving one's technique and endurance. Both are valid, and, to my mind, neither is more worthy of praise than the other.
I would recommend JMiller's "Fun, and Fast" thread for a lifetime of swimming.
In the summer especially there are many threads on open water swimming for the fun and pleasure of it - no medals, races, or timers. (The thread "Where we swim OW" has more pictures of nonracing venues than of racing venues.) Regular work on technique in a daily, disciplined swimming program makes the fun possible; a decision to compete in meets helps one fine-tune the daily discipline. It's all good.
:)
Maybe I don't understand but how are pictures showing proper technique, nutrition tips, example workouts, etc. not relevant to all USMS members? Sure, there are sections that are devoted to competitions but to say that the entire magazine ignores the 'over 90% that doesn't compete' is incorrect.
My USA Tri magazines are comprised almost completely of boring rankings. USMS Swimmer seems like pictionary in comparison.
