Dara Torres-Amazing

I found out what caused my bounce of 100lbs and have since lost 70+ pounds. I didn't take any magic pills either.

Paul is it a fad to train right, work hard, and devote the time she does to swim better.

Tracy, this will be my last post on this subject...and you quote above is the perfect time for me to exit. You've twisted a hell of a lot that some of us have tried to discuss here...in subtle ways that remind me of my radical friends on the right and left of the political spectrum...always avoiding the specific's of what is being questioned and immediately going to the easy route of accusing us who question as attacking...pretty sad. Bonds case and your support of the fact that he was never proven to be guilty in spite of the fact he did admit to using the clear and the cream (sports.espn.go.com/.../story, the incredible physiological changes he went thru and the simple fact that you believe with all your heart as George does that will a little bit of stretching, the latest fad training regime, and $100k a year in over the counter supplements anyone over 40 can achieve the level of success Dara has...I remind you the success comes after 7 years off and from somebody who'd times were at the elite end of the spectrum as far as human performance for swimming...not a masters swimmer trying to dial in some better technique are all wonderful in the realm of hero worship...but sadly "blind" in the real world we live in. Wonderful things are done in sports everyday...break thru's occur occasinally, you choose to accept blindly this is one of them and attack those of us who are tired of seeing cheating going on at every level of sport. I hope Dara never tests negative, I hope we have witnessed a profound breakthrough in sports...but I refuse to be intimidated out of questioning feats such as this by anyone and sorry Jim but I/we who love the sport we put so much time in won't "give it a break" because the real world needs people who don't blindly worship others and are willing to ask hard questions. By the way regarding McGuire, Andro was illegal per the DEA but not by MLB...nice eh? oh I guess breaking a federal law doesn't matter as long as baseball doesn't care! Paul, I would challenge you to go back and find a place where I "accused" people without first being labeled in one way or the other! If countering someone's point of view with what I "believe" to be true is accusing....then sure enough I am guilty. I would honestly apologize to anyone that I offended by trying to prove my point....never my intention. But to sit by when people make snide remarks to make their points never has been my habit. I actually thought this was a pretty reasonable discussion about the subject........

Well, I have been told I'm not so good with reading comprehension, but I thought I read you questioning whether Geek might have something "against women in general?" No, I can't think of many women who would intentionally harm their child. But some people take crazy risks with their health and life (e.g., FloJo). Agree, there are some out there that are just plain stupid if you ask me. Specially when it comes to the possibility of stardom. The comment was in reference to the "unwed mother" comment he made. After that I simply asked a question....was it an accusation? Not meant that way.....just questioning his motives.....same way a lot of people are questioning Dara. People here are saying they are just "asking" questions...am I allowed to as well?

There is a difference, I think, between making an accusation and expressing skepticism. As for evidence of PED use, if there were any then we would have nothing to discuss, would we? Personally speaking, my skepticisim is not based on the fact that no one has done this before. This is very different, in my mind, from breaking a barrier such as 19 sec in the 50. Setting American records at the age of 41, and after having retired from the sport for 13 of the last 16 years, cannot be explained on the basis of novel training methods, nutrition, or pregnancy. She is an anomaly, a true phenomenon. Or she is juiced. And if she is juiced, I don't believe we will ever know. Which would mean that we have entered a new era in sports.

It would be interesting to take two sizeable groups of young sprint swimmers (say, age 17 to 21), train half of them using a conventional high mileage training plan and half using Dara Torres's training plan and see which group has the most improvement over an 18 month stretch.

It would be interesting to take two sizeable groups of young sprint swimmers (say, age 17 to 21), train half of them using a conventional high mileage training plan and half using Dara Torres's training plan and see which group has the most improvement over an 18 month stretch. If I remember correctly, the NYT article said that DT did the same workout as the sprinters at the club where she was training, except she didn't do doubles. From what I could tell, I think it was the dryland and the recovery program that were more innovative, not the "wet work."

Would you put that garbage in your system knowing you would pass it directly on to your kid? Not many women would that I know. There are news stories on a regular basis about druggies who use while pregnant and put their children's lives in danger to feed their habit. You could probably argue that competition is (on some small level) similar to drug addiction. I know that it is addictive for me. Who is to say that the allure of Olympic gold isn't strong enough to overpower the natural instincts of a mother to protect her child. All I am saying is that the argument that a mother couldn't possibly do that to her child is not really all that convincing in my mind. I have used most of my posts to defend Dara. The bottom line for me is that she is, by all outward appearances, an affable person. That is enough for me, without any real evidence to the contrary, to like her and cheer her anomalous achievements. That's not to say that I won't be extremely disappointed if it turns out that she is a cheat. It's funny that Bonds was brought up. I can't help but think that if he had been more friendly and outgoing, that the public may have stood behind him a bit more when he was under fire.

Jim, I think being tested up the wazoo would give anyone pause...

Our ever-controversial sports columnist, Jason Whitlock, wrote a column about Dara the other day: Full column: www.kansascity.com/.../693347.html There’s something fishy about old swimmer By JASON WHITLOCK The Kansas City Star A white Jewish mother 12 days older than I is the star of the U.S. Olympic swimming trials, and the American media are treating her like she’s Barry Bonds. That’s progress..... Today there were two letters to the editor in response to that column: Is the “41-year-old mother of one” referred to in the news article (7/7, “Ageless Torres takes another race in record fashion”) the same person as the “white Jewish mother” referred to in Jason Whitlock’s opinion column (7/6, “Swim story sounds fishy”)? Yes, I am being sarcastic. The headline on Whitlock’s column with the word “fishy” indicates immediately that there was something suspicious about the ability of this woman to perform this well. If this person had been any other race, color or faith, would Whitlock’s column have so indicated? If it did, it would have been wrong as well. Yes, I am white, and I am Jewish. But I am sure people of other races and faiths are just as disgusted with Whitlock’s comments as I am. Bill Kaiser Overland Park "White Jewish," "41-year-old mother of an infant child," "12 days older than I", two surgeries, a "late bloomer" (even), wins an Olympics trial because she’s "sucking down asthma medication," Jason Whitlock says. Gee, Jason. Why do I doubt your take has anything to do with this beautiful lady Dara Torres being a winner? You might want to try racing Natalie Coughlin. We’ll give you a lap head start and a flotation device. I’m thinking desire, dedication, talent, persistence, ability and an Olympic swimmer’s body might have something to do with it. Bill Brewer Kansas City