Dara Torres-Amazing

Ask M. Jones where her story ended, or Barry Bonds. Nothing wrong with a critical eye towards unprecedented accomplishments, especially in a day and age where almost every single super human sporting achievement of the last decade has been proven a lie. I recall last summer on this forum as holding out Roger Clemens as a pillar of responsibility and hard work at an older age for sports. Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me. So by this kind of lopsided reasoning....Phelps, Hoff, Coughlin and everybody else who breaks records (because it's a "super human sports achievement") is dirty? Wow, quite a leap off the scale there if you ask me. I would agree with all of you nay sayers if there was a person that stood up and said they saw her do something....or a test came back with suspicious levels of something....but guess what.....NOT ONE of those things has happened. Again I ask all of you ACCUSERS: What does she have to do? Nobody can or has answered that one basic question!!!!!

There ain't a shred of evidence out there at all....end of story..... Let me get this straight. You find absolutely nothing out of the ordinary or the least bit suspicious about the whole Dara Torres story?

Equating the mistakes a few people made as being universal, that's just foolish. Ask M. Jones where her story ended, or Barry Bonds. Nothing wrong with a critical eye towards unprecedented accomplishments, especially in a day and age where almost every single super human sporting achievement of the last decade has been proven a lie. I recall last summer on this forum as holding out Roger Clemens as a pillar of responsibility and hard work at an older age for sports. Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me.

Let me get this straight. You find absolutely nothing out of the ordinary or the least bit suspicious about the whole Dara Torres story? No, not at all......go back and look at the info on post 1212 that I put on there....she actually has a pretty good history of doing exactly what she is doing today....it started in 1983 when she broke the WR in the 50 at age 15.

No, not at all......go back and look at the info on post 1212 that I put on there....she actually has a pretty good history of doing exactly what she is doing today....it started in 1983 when she broke the WR in the 50 at age 15. So in your mind she is neither juiced nor an anomaly.

Theoretically speaking, Dara Torres is a winner! Yes, but we're attempting to set aside convention and have a theoretical discussion.

Theoretically speaking, if an athlete is found to have used PED's to obtain a spot on an Olympic team, could the athlete who missed their shot because of the cheating sue the cheater for damages? For instance, lost revenue from advertising contracts or paid personal appearances and clinics.

So in your mind she is neither juiced nor an anomaly. Actually, yes she is an anomaly! But if she is an anomaly.....so are a whole lot of other Masters Swimmers! Maybe not to the extent she is but, look at the progression of US and World Records in swimming.....there are times being clocked today that people thought were physically impossible just a few years ago. Training? Equipment? Supplements? All of the above?

Like others on here have said already.....How many others have tried the regimen that she is doing? Not many from what I know......so who is to say that the Smiths, Fort, Jeff or anybody else in here could not have some surprising results using her formula. I have read a lot about what she is doing. There is some interesting stuff but I wouldn't say the individual bits are "never been done" type of innovation. Putting them all together? Maybe there is some kind of synergy, I guess. I even bought a DVD of the meridian stretching method and tried the partner-less stretches a few times. I wasn't impressed, and that guy seems pretty flaky. Granted, I do not have the luxury of quitting my job, hiring a nanny and a support staff of coaches, personal trainers, stretchers, and masseurs. But I work out pretty much, have never taken an extended vacation from swimming, and can reproduce most times from my early 30s (granted, I was less into masters swimming back then). So I think I have a reasonable basis to predict what is POSSIBLE if I were chuck it all and train full time. I am 43 years old, and it is EXTREMELY unlikely that I can equal or better my college times even if I made it my life's mission. Believe me, it galls me to say it because I train much smarter and know more about swimming and competing than I did back then. And I retired when I graduated at 21; I think I would have been swimming faster in my mid- to late-20s if I had continued to train full time, much less used modern backstroke turns and SDKs. But I watch the young kids train and compete against them enough to see the difference. They recover so much faster than I do and can step it up 2 or 3 extra notches in races. It just isn't something I believe I can replicate at my age. I can only speak for myself. I think the Smiths are on record as saying pretty much the same for themselves. John made an interesting comment that the more elite swimmer one was, the more difficult it would be to accomplish the feat of equalling or bettering lifetime bests. Maybe it is true. Dennis Baker trains about as hard as I can imagine a 40+ swimmer can train. He accomplished an amazing feat in the 200 fly (for his age)...and was still quite a few seconds from his lifetime best (I believe he was a sub-2:00 in his prime, or somewhere close to that). I wonder if SVDL could come close to her old times if she did what Dara did...but I think that would still not be enough to make the current Olympic team, much less set a new AR. I have no idea if DT is using PEDs. I saw a TV special on her a few months ago, and I was a little taken aback by the many pills she did take (OTC stuff, I guess). Nothing illegal, I would assume -- didn't she say she was taking creatine at one point? -- but the mindset was a little disturbing to me. (I use the occasional Advil for pain/inflammation and sometimes drink chocolate milk for recovery, that's pretty much it.) But I do applaud DT's aggressive testing protocol. I don't know what else she could do. I doubt we will ever know the full truth behind her amazing performances so it is just a matter of opinion or faith.

Actually, yes she is an anomaly! But if she is an anomaly.....so are a whole lot of other Masters Swimmers! In which case they are not anomalies. Maybe not to the extent she is... Maybe not? That's a bit of understatement.