Are shoulder injuries due solely to improper stroke mechanics

I think it verges on a mass delusion and sickness. Alternatively, it could be due to an overwhelming decades long abundance of evidence. Prolonged swimming gives one sore shoulders, perfect technique or not. Sitting on a rock in the desert with your legs crossed and humming will not change this fact.

Leslie, maybe it's our genetic predisposition that makes us that way? I think it is a survival of the "fly" species.....only the strong & stubborn survive the rigors of butterstruggle through the years....but not without adaptations....our bodies adapt by dislocating our shoulders to accomodate the stressors of the fly.:rofl: I'm probably one that needs to stop training more than 5 strokes of fly at a time......that sounds like a sprint flyer's dream! I can only hold my stroke for a 50 then it becomes butterstruggle. I no longer swim the 100 fly....I just can't train fly enough to hold it together due to shoulder pain. I have found I do ok only training IM. Maybe I need Terry to look at my fly and tell me what I can do to improve!

A simple solution to this conundrum would be to outlaw butterfly...

Alternatively, it could be due to an overwhelming decades long abundance of evidence. Prolonged swimming gives one sore shoulders, perfect technique or not. Sitting on a rock in the desert with your legs crossed and humming will not change this fact. I almost said "Where's Aquageek when we need him?" in my previous post! Then I see your comment...ironic! I must have ESP! We need your sense of humor!

Sleep on one side, face on back of hand and elbow pointed at bed headboard =vs= Sleep on one side, lying atop arm =vs= Sleep flat on back Any studies done on the effects of sleep posture ? I'm not sure of studies, but if I sleep atop my arm ... well, if I even try to sleep atop my arm I'm in searing pain rather quickly. Can't do it ...

I'm not sure of studies, but if I sleep atop my arm ... well, if I even try to sleep atop my arm I'm in searing pain rather quickly. Can't do it ... My doctor told me to never raise my hand above shoulder level when I lay on my side. It places too much stress on your shoulder. The only time I lay on my bad right shoulder is when I am doing my rotator cuff exercises for my left shoulder!

I don't understand why you, as a coach, seem to minimize the importance of anatomical factors. It is well-recognized (in the medical literature) that shoulder impingement in many cases results from a muscle imbalance, hence the emphasis on strengthening the rotator cuff and stabilizing the scapula. The shoulder joint, unlike the hip, is not a "ball in socket"; rather, the head of the humerus is suspended by surrounding muscles and ligaments. As we age, muscles weaken, ligaments dessicate, joint spaces narrow--independent of our technique. Consequently, I believe all Masters swimmers (injured or not) should adhere to a home exercise program that maintains the health of the shoulder joint and allows them to keep swimming (with proper technique, of course). Gull, I completely agree. Even though I have swam competitively for almost 32 years off and on, I did not have shoulder problems until the past 5-6 years. My technique has not changed. My body (shoulder joint especially) has just "aged".

Rather than stating that technique is the "primary causative factor", I would suggest something to the effect that technique is a "contributing factor." I suspect we could all agree with that statement.

Here's another:How can you tell a lawyer is lying? (2 possible answers) I know one: Her (don't take this personally) lips are moving. What's the other?

So those of you doing preventative maintenance routines on your shoulders, what do those routines look like? Are they weighlifting sets or PT type exercises or both? Wyrbosome: I weight lift and do PT-type exercises. I've read through the Buchberger 12 book. I understand there is a Buchberger 12 video that I should probably purchase that has additional exercises. I haven't read Poolraat's book, but I probably should too. When I'm being disciplined, I do lots of high rep light weight exercises with handweights, shoulder blade protraction/retraction stuff, triceps extensions, prone hitch hiker, shrugs, sidelying stuff, rotating a ball on the wall. When I go to the gym, I always make sure to do the chest press and seated dips. But I do not bend my elbows. I put the setting on 60 pounds or so and only make smaller shrug-like movements to target the rotator cuff muscles. I do some of my hand weights on a bosu to strengthen my loose ankles and work the core. It is probably advisable to do lat pulldowns and V pulldowns, but I'm somehow worried they might hurt shoulders. What they would probably do is strengthen the upper back, which may help the trap/rhomboid muscles. But I'm not an expert on this. Hope that's somewhat helpful. Good luck.