I just competed (and I use the term loosely) in the 2003 National Senior Games and found it very disappointing to see that Master swimmers have pretty much taken over the awards platform. This event used to be mainly for recreational athletes who either could not or did not want to compete at a higher level. This was our opportunity to have a moment in the spotlight by competing against athletes who were “equal” to our level of skill. Our moment to believe we were the best in our group and to share our victories with our friends.
By coming to this event, you (the Master swimmers) have assured that no one who is a recreational athlete will ever get a medal and you have pushed the minimum standard time so low that many athletes no longer qualify to even come to the National event. In talking with over 85 athletes of various ages, it was generally agreed that within the next few years, this will be “just another Master’s venue”. You already have four National Events EACH YEAR, the SC Yards, SC Meters, LC Meters, and the YMCA Nationals. Why can’t you leave ONE event that takes places every OTHER year for the swimmers who will never be at any of your meets? Out of the 85 swimmers I spoke with, an overwhelming percent said they would probably not go to the event in Pittsburgh, PA since there would probably be more Masters there and no place for them.
I realize that this event is open to all seniors, but I ask you, how would you feel to have your only chance to win a medal taken away by someone who probably has a box full of them? If you look at the times, you will see that that the top three places in nearly all events went to Masters who all hold top 10 times in USMS. So the athletes, who are not Masters, had to settle for ribbons. There were so many disappointed families, friends, and swimmers who had hoped to win a medal and stand on the awards platform and share their shining moment with their families. Instead it was Masters and the majority of them didn’t even bring families. It was “just another meet” for them.
I’m sure I’m going to be made the “bad guy” by writing this, but my mother is 83 years old and watched her medal go to a Master swimmer and my heart broke for her. She may not be here for any future games and she really worked hard to do well, then you guys showed up. Please, leave the recreational National Event for us and be happy with your four events each year.
Former Member
Well, I also workout on my own. There is a good masters team in my area but I live on the opposite side of town and don't want to get up around 5:00 Am in the morning to swim in a practice 20 miles away and then go to work. I also workout twice a week in a small health club pool around 15 yards in length after work and twice a week on my days off at a 25 yard pool rec pool with lap swimmers, some of the younger ones can beat me by 15 seconds in a 100 yard freestyle. I do have an advantage in that I swam on various teams years ago as a child. However, I'm a lot slower than I was as a child but you are right, I can beat most rec swimmers over 40 years old,particularly women in lap swimming practice. So, you are right in that you have a disadvantage.
I do not "care so much about winning to the exclusion of all else", but I do think that I should be able to swim on a level playing field and at least have a "Fair" opportunity to win. It was never about "my" medal, but the one for my mother. She has consistently been overswum by Masters and I would just once like to see her get a medal at Nationals.
I'm not sure why you are puzzled. I've tried to be clear. Those Master swimmers who are top ten and consistently place in USMS National events have no place (in my opinion) at the Senior Games. They are rude and they deprive the fitness athlete of an opportunity to experience what they experience when they win at the National level. That's all - nothing more - nothing less.
Just give the fitnes athlete the OPPORTUNITY to have the experience.
It would seem to me that if you truly want to compete then you truly want to compete against the best regardless of whether a person is a Master's swimmer or not.
Does having elite swimmers at a Senior Meet prevent you from setting a personal best? Does having a Masters swimmer at a Senior meet prevent you from training as hard as you can year round?
I recently competed in my first USMS national meet. Didn't bother me one single bit that I didn't get a medal or that there were Olympians there making me look like a guppy. It was actually motivational.
You state "Just give the fitnes athlete the OPPORTUNITY to have the experience." What opportunity and experience are you being denied? The opportunity to get a trinket? C'mon, that's silly. Competing is all about testing yourself against those of all abilities.
It's too bad the master's swimmers you encountered were rude. That's inexcusable. My question is: should swimmers who have trained harder and achieved faster times be penalized for their success? Why should participation in USMS exclude those swimmers from having an opportunity at the Senior Olympics or anywhere else? We'd all like to see someone we care about do well but I doubt if there's much satisfaction in winning simply because no one else showed up.
If ya'll are still trying to find the results for the Senior Olympics held in Newport News last week, be aware that ya' gotta go to the website of the Coast Guard Blue Dolphins who put on the best swimming meet I have ever seen, in a great facility, with the friendliest people.
But there are a few things you should be aware of before going there. Like, ages 50-64 swam on Monday through Wednesday, and 65-100 swam on Thursday through Saturday. The results are in the order of the events as swum, so you gotta go pretty much through everything to find out what you wanna know. So,
cgbdswimming.org/
have fun, but look out you don't get wet! and viva 440.
The NSGA website states that its mission is to support both the "seasoned athlete who has been competing for years" as well as the "eager rookie." The woman high jumper pictured on the home page appears to be in pretty good shape for a rookie.
Matt, what do you mean that some nut from California will beat you. I swam in California as a kid and I probably now can't even beat you in breaststroke, your weakest stroke. In fact Arizona in my age group is probably more competitive than the SPMA is in women. According to the national stats, LA like Chicago grew mainly because of immirgation, so your area does have something in common with LA, immirgants!
Although I understand the frustration, I think it's unfair to single out Master's swimming for three reasons:
1) The charter of the National Seniors Games organization fully embraces seasoned competitors - no exclusionary level of ability or experience is mentioned.
2) Why should being in USMS somehow make us automatically unable to compete? For example, I have a very modest ability to swim distance feestyle, but because of that or my USMS membership card, does it mean that I shouldn't be able to compete in the NSGs in the backstroke? I assure you, I would be slugging it out for last place at the NSG in backstroke. Where/how does one draw a line?
3) Having come from Track & Field, I am quite familiar with the people competing in that sport. I looked over the list of T&F competitors and noticed many people who have been studmuffins for years. (Have a look at the 65-69 Men's 200 meter dash times) In two cases, at least, people had been in the Olympic Trials, if not the team, way back when. So, if having studmuffins competing is a problem, it's not just a swimming problem.
Suggestion: Why not join USMS and compete in some of the local meets? I think that you would find that most of the people involved are actually very supportive and friendly - not just the back-of-packers (e.g. me), but the studmuffins as well. Even the studs train with other people of various abilities and most appreciate how hard the unwashed masses have to work to do well. Please do join us!
I hope nobody makes you out to be a bad guy in this. You clearly are bothered by your experience and have right to express your feelings.
I read two things from your posts. I'm reading between the lines a little and hope I didn't get it wrong.
1) Your perception is that some Masters swimmers showed some boorish behavior. I think it's unfortunate that people treat others poorly. Being faster or "better" doesn't give people that right. It happens at Masters meets as well. I doubt that Masters swimmers have a monopoly on poor behavior though. Take all masters swimmers out of the meet and someone is still going to be dominant and I'll bet someone will eventually treat people badly, if it hasn't happened already. If these swimmers had showed better behavior would their speed have still mattered to you?
2) Some Masters swimmers simply don't belong at the meet. I added "Some" because I don't think your objecting to all Masters swimmers. If you are objecting to all then I'd say you may have a skewed perception of all Masters swimmers. I checked the results and saw a number of names from my LMSC that are not "elite" and they would probably describe themselves as recreational or fitness swimmers. Some of them swim without coaches and teams and most llikely swim no more than you. Some placed fairly high and some didn't place at all. Telling them they can't swim because they have other opportunities just seems wrong to me. Most of these swimmers will never go to the national meets you mentioned. Some don't even go to the state level meets. They only real difference between them and you is they paid the Masters registration fee.
If you can figure out a way of dealing with bad behavior then I hope you can share it with all organizations. I personally have my doubts about being able to put rules around what constitutes poor sportsmanship. Power to you if you figure out a way.
You're also faced with figuring out how to determine when someone is too good to compete at the Senior Games. That's going to be a challenge. If someone isn't a Masters swimmer but they are really fast should they not be allowed to compete? Someone is always going to win and if there are more than 3 people in an event then someone isn't going to get a medal. Regardless of who is 4th they may think the person in 1st is too fast and shouldn't be there. I don't know what to do about that.
I wish you luck with what you need to do and hope your future experiences are better. I hope you also realize that you can't lump all masters swimmers into the same group.
