Ditch core work?

I'm tired of arguing about sandbagging and split requests, so let's fight over the value of the wobbly ball -- www.dailymail.co.uk/.../Why-sit-ups-bad-body-wobbly-gym-ball-wont-help-either.html
  • My drill of choice for assessing and developing smart core awareness: Thanks. I'll give that a try.
  • Former Member
    Former Member
    Greg are you in the 50-54 AG by chance? If so I highly recommend swimming with a disengaged core. Slouch at the shoulders, let your legs splay apart like scissors and let your kick do what it wants w/o any rhythm or timing to your catch and pull. THIS is the key to fast, efficient freestyle. ;)
  • Former Member
    Former Member
    My drill of choice for assessing and developing smart core awareness: www.youtube.com/watch Simply explained, obliques are being engaged to allow the body to flip from one side to the other. Hands finish the job with a slight sweeping action to provide propulsive forces. Those who still don't engage their core correctly (regardless of the strength or tonus put to it) basically fail miserably at that one. From above: www.youtube.com/watch Good swimmers generally get this drill within the first 5 minutes in trying it. Those who are not as skilled, ie still learning the basics will rather need several weeks.
  • Greg are you in the 50-54 AG by chance? If so I highly recommend swimming with a disengaged core. Slouch at the shoulders, let your legs splay apart like scissors and let your kick do what it wants w/o any rhythm or timing to your catch and pull. THIS is the key to fast, efficient freestyle. ;) Ahhh, finally! The words I've been longing to hear! I'm only just shy of turning 45, but hey, no need to wait, right?
  • Former Member
    Former Member
    "Engage your core" is fairly meaningless to me as well. I do weighted exercises to strengthen the "trunk." But I don't bother much with crunches or wobbly balls, and I think I have a fairly strong core. I recall going to a "Pilates mat" class once. It was so easy that I laughed and left -- that is a good example of the concept of "core training" run amok. Yeah, but what if you had to do Pilates for longer than 30 seconds?:thhbbb:
  • My drill of choice for assessing and developing smart core awareness: Good swimmers generally get this drill within the first 5 minutes in trying it. Those who are not as skilled, ie still learning the basics will rather need several weeks. Looks like I'm not in the 5 minute club. But after 20-25, I started catching on and my body wasn't wiggling to-and-fro quite as much. But it felt like my hands/arms were playing a fairly significant role in initiating the flipping from side to side. Not sure if that's how it should feel when done correctly?? Another "core connection" that became clearer in the pool today: my left arm recovery is especially short and choppy and I've been working on extending out a bit more, but have found it difficult. Today I noticed that my core engagement is especially weak on that side. So I concentrated on engaging more fully during the left side recovery and that felt like it evened it out with my right side recovery. Again, it felt way over-exaggerated and "wrong" because it was so different from what I'm used to, but it seemed to work well. General lesson: even if you know what your body is supposed to be doing, it can't do it if it doesn't have the support from the core.
  • "His own studies have demonstrated that repeated bending of the spine, as happens when we do crunches, can damage spinal discs over time." Uh-oh. I probably do 17,000 flip turns a year. Guess I'm in big trouble.
  • Thanks again for more encouragement, vo2 (now that you know I'm safely out of your age group, right?!:agree:). It's obvious you've traveled a ways down this road I'm just getting my bearings on. Looking forward to some of that payoff. Sounds like a good tip about keeping those ankles flexed, too. I'll throw that one in the mix as well.
  • Former Member
    Former Member
    Good for you Greg stick with it. Remember, the HTFU and bag more yardage motto certainly has it's place once gross technique issues are resolved. BUT until that time technique is still a huge limiter if not the predominant issue. I swim with guys who simply refuse to look into these things, even after their times have stayed stagnant for a decade. They just won't accept that little things like plantar flexion of the ankles will make a difference in drag. Why? B/c when they try it 'oh this is hard and feels weird' so they go back to having underwater drag parachutes for feet. You can only lead a horse to water.....glad you are drinking up! Specifically what you felt on one side of your stroke is a nice indicator that you are beginning to feel the right things. That slight core tension is good and you just like you don't ever want to let go of the water or lose contact, so goes core tension. Not spastic 1,000 lb squat tension, just enough to know it's in the drivers seat. The fact you are becoming aware of a particular area of your stroke that is causing you to disengage your core tells me you are paying attention and on the right track. Keep at it the payoff is large. If it were easy then everyone would do it! Looks like I'm not in the 5 minute club. But after 20-25, I started catching on and my body wasn't wiggling to-and-fro quite as much. But it felt like my hands/arms were playing a fairly significant role in initiating the flipping from side to side. Not sure if that's how it should feel when done correctly?? Another "core connection" that became clearer in the pool today: my left arm recovery is especially short and choppy and I've been working on extending out a bit more, but have found it difficult. Today I noticed that my core engagement is especially weak on that side. So I concentrated on engaging more fully during the left side recovery and that felt like it evened it out with my right side recovery. Again, it felt way over-exaggerated and "wrong" because it was so different from what I'm used to, but it seemed to work well. General lesson: even if you know what your body is supposed to be doing, it can't do it if it doesn't have the support from the core.
  • Repeated bending of anything without support (living tissues in this case) will fail over use. Not too useful of an experiment in my opinion.