Has anyone used any of the strength training plans from this book by David Salo? I had planned to follow this starting in January, but when it came right down to it, the plans seemed nebulous and possibly a bit out of date compared to other plans I had available (non swim specific). So I went with another option for the time being.
Any thoughts, opinions?
Also:
"Cross-training"
No.
Yeah, yeah, tomato-tomahto. We aren't going to agree on trivial semantics and I am going to continue to use the tried-and-true definition of cross-training as "anything other than the target sport."
I get it: you're saying lifting is very very very (add more if you want) important. It is possible to do that without redefining words.
Gotta say, I LOVE this thread! I've never had wtf and wussiness and suck it up directed at me. It's a new experience and I kinda like it. It's refreshing compared to the "listen to your body" advice that I typically hear.
I'm trying to find out how intensely I can work before the gains are minimal or nonexistent.
It sounds like you may need to do slightly less in each dryland workout. I'm not a wuss either, and I had to learn to curb my intensity somewhat.
"Listen to your body" -- yes to an extent. You don't want to be in pain in the weight room. But you should be tired later. Usually the DOMs improves somewhat after you've been lifting for awhile. If a person backed off every time they were tired, they'd make no forward progress. This is what Jazz means. I'm not a huge fan of lifting to failure either; you can make strength gains without doing that. The most important thing is consistency.
FWIW, after I got serious about weights for a few months and then rested some for a meet, I had big time drops.
NO, hearing suck it up is fine.. I like feeling DOMS, what I don't like is having shaking arms when I'm trying to swim with cooked pasta arms. I don't have the luxury of separating weights from a swim workout at morning/evening, so I am locked into weights and then run to swim.
And basically, that's what I'm trying to do--lift strategically around swim workouts and mid season, not when i'm swimming for results. For instance, I've been off weights the last 2 wks because of a meet, and I THINK I may delay a bit more because I'm considering an OW event in a month. I think I need to spend the lift time doing more long steady swims at this point alternating with structured coached workouts.
Plus my gardening and weeding, which sure feels like deadlifting!
I didn't grow up doing sports, so beginning at age 41 (I'm 43 now) has been strange--figuring out when to suck it up and when it is a real limitation.
I think mid May I will hit the weights again 2x/week. That seems to be good for what I can handle with my life ( two young sons, and a husband).
Yeah. :bow: I feel like building to that level of strength is important for me for swimming, and even worth feeling a bit trashed as I get there. But I'm a big girl--5'10 and 165 lbs. It's a lot to lift!
I'm heavy for a swimmer - even in good shape I'm 185-190 lbs, and just under 5'11. When I started back I couldn't do one pull up. I've managed to get up to sets of 10 as well, but currently happy to do about 6-8 at one time.
I want to be strong, but I do get quite bulky. I'm also starting to focus more on my 200 ***, so wondering if I'd benefit by focusing more on keeping my weight down for a while with more aerobic conditioning and circuits.
Seeing "42" made me realize I had made a typo; it was 32 push ups on one minute. So, I don't know if it's "fantastic" anymore... :blush:
IMO it still is. I do not more then 15 at one time, but it is improving.
OK, then, what is the prevailing opinion about how to tell when lifting has become too much? Speed decreases are bound to happen but what would be YOUR signal that less might be better?
About 2 months ago I tried to swim a coached workout, and I had to quit after 700 m. My shoulder just gave way like muscle failure. I'd lifted to failure, but I'd never felt that sort of muscle failure while swimming. That was when I took some time off and decided to stick to 2x/week of weights. With strategic timing to keep weights as far as possible from speed/lactate type workouts. This seemed to be a good combination for me.
Um, isn't this exactly what sprinters and race-pace people say when they advocate for (much) more rest between max efforts? Or for recovery days between quality days? In any event, Jazz, you're a bit of an odd source for this statement, what with your mega-yardage philosophy.
When did I say "don't rest?" I spend much more time not lifting weights than I spend lifting weights. I spend much more time not swimming then I spend swimming. But I still swim and lift weights, because if I didn't do those things I'd be slow. This is not an extraordinarily complicated concept.
Just to be super clear: I believe most masters swimmers have a serious deficiency in effort when lifting weights. Swimmers are very eager to complain about soreness, feeling tired, etc. Very few people are interested in working hard consistently to get faster. So that's why my universal advice is: if you are tired, but you are not actually injured and your strength numbers are not decreasing, then suck it up and keep going.
If you couldn't swim more than 700 then I think you did the right thing.
Wtf is this? Lifting weights never made anyone's muscles just stop working. That sounds like glycogen depletion to me and the answer is eat more, and don't be a wuss.
Look, Jazz Hands, I never quit a workout. :) Never. yeah, glycogen depletion it probably was. But I was run down and ragged.
I'm trying to figure out the balance here. I'm a developing swimmer and athlete. Those that know me IRL know that I lift intensely and swim with all I have. I do believe, and those that coach me concur, that I am inclined to err on the side of intensity and not wussiness.
