After recognizing that my stroke is much longer than most OWS, I decided to poke around and see if stroke was different for OW as opposed to swimming in a pool. I found this (There is a part 2 if you click on the channel and scroll down the right side):
YouTube - Swim Smooth: What Is An Efficient Freestyle Stroke? Part 1
I would love to get reactions. I know that when I quicken my stroke rate and shorten my stroke I seem to fatigue much more quickly. However, this could be due to not pursuing this long enough to re-establish breathing patterns. (When I concentrate on my stroke, I tend to hold my breath without realizing it).
I do know that while my per 100 pace is slowly improving with more speed work in my work outs, it has dropped now where near what it used to be 20 years ago.
So the question is: does the longer stroke being used by the swimmer become a disadvantage as the conditions worsen? If so, how bad do they have to get.
My intuition is "Yes" - but it's based only on the observation that the fastest pool swimmers are usually not the fastest OW swimmers - and the latter often have punchier stroke technique. Of course, the only way to know for sure is to do a controlled experiment.
If I understand Chaos he is saying they as to each individual swimmer, decreasing SPL makes them a faster pool swimmer. Not necessarily when they are working on the skill, but it does once they return to their previous SR.
"Once they return to their previous SR" is the key point. If you're already swimming at an efficient combination of SL & SR, increasing SL can only make you slower.
If I have a low SPL and low SR then as I swim in rough water the wave, or waves if the the wind and deep swells are not identical in direction and period, will interfere with the rhythm of my stroke and cause me to lose momentum.
This describes my experience exactly.
was there a sprint to the finish? or did they spread out?
From what I can tell, they were in pretty much the same orientation at the finish as during the 8K clip.
since 14 SPL seems to be a comfortable i would try and design sets that help you test the hypothesis that a higher SPL will be faster....
i would assign sets like this:
12x 600 on 9:00 descend in sets of 3
.....
That's great advice - thanks. I've done similar sets a few times, but not quite as systematically as you describe. One wrinkle is that my hypothesis about SL/SR relates specifically to rough-water conditions, which makes it somewhat harder to test.
thats what i would do (and its why i don't have any friends)
I am your friend!
While my physical effort felt very similar at both 15 SPL and 17 SPL, the 17 SPL 50's were much faster. However, I found I can't sustain 17 SPL at higher stroke rate for longer than 200 yards.
My question would be, are you really holding your physical effort constant between 15 & 17 SPL? If you're getting tired sooner, it would seem to indicate that you're expending more energy.
When I try to increase SR (keeping effort constant), I'm consciously trying to pull less water - letting my catch slide a bit, and perhaps not following through as far. Chaos has described this in a different thread as a "lighter touch."
25y may be too short a distance for me to experiment.
To take that even further, the ideal place to experiment is in actual open water - preferably rough water. To me, having to deal with chop and navigation is where the higher SR really shines. I can't practice a "rough water stroke" in a 25-yard pool, either - it just doesn't feel right.
So the question is: does the longer stroke being used by the swimmer become a disadvantage as the conditions worsen? If so, how bad do they have to get.
My intuition is "Yes" - but it's based only on the observation that the fastest pool swimmers are usually not the fastest OW swimmers - and the latter often have punchier stroke technique. Of course, the only way to know for sure is to do a controlled experiment.
If I understand Chaos he is saying they as to each individual swimmer, decreasing SPL makes them a faster pool swimmer. Not necessarily when they are working on the skill, but it does once they return to their previous SR.
"Once they return to their previous SR" is the key point. If you're already swimming at an efficient combination of SL & SR, increasing SL can only make you slower.
If I have a low SPL and low SR then as I swim in rough water the wave, or waves if the the wind and deep swells are not identical in direction and period, will interfere with the rhythm of my stroke and cause me to lose momentum.
This describes my experience exactly.
was there a sprint to the finish? or did they spread out?
From what I can tell, they were in pretty much the same orientation at the finish as during the 8K clip.
since 14 SPL seems to be a comfortable i would try and design sets that help you test the hypothesis that a higher SPL will be faster....
i would assign sets like this:
12x 600 on 9:00 descend in sets of 3
.....
That's great advice - thanks. I've done similar sets a few times, but not quite as systematically as you describe. One wrinkle is that my hypothesis about SL/SR relates specifically to rough-water conditions, which makes it somewhat harder to test.
thats what i would do (and its why i don't have any friends)
I am your friend!
While my physical effort felt very similar at both 15 SPL and 17 SPL, the 17 SPL 50's were much faster. However, I found I can't sustain 17 SPL at higher stroke rate for longer than 200 yards.
My question would be, are you really holding your physical effort constant between 15 & 17 SPL? If you're getting tired sooner, it would seem to indicate that you're expending more energy.
When I try to increase SR (keeping effort constant), I'm consciously trying to pull less water - letting my catch slide a bit, and perhaps not following through as far. Chaos has described this in a different thread as a "lighter touch."
25y may be too short a distance for me to experiment.
To take that even further, the ideal place to experiment is in actual open water - preferably rough water. To me, having to deal with chop and navigation is where the higher SR really shines. I can't practice a "rough water stroke" in a 25-yard pool, either - it just doesn't feel right.
