Mathematically, how do you work out 'three quarter pace"?
Let's say (for the sake of easy calculations) your best time for an event is 1 minute. In practice, you want to go three quarter pace. So a 100% effort will result in a time of 60 seconds. A 75% effort should result in a longer time. My rudimentary maths tells me I should divide 100 by 75 and multiply the result by 60. That works out to 80 seconds, which is a minute and 20 seconds. Why does that sound much slower than what I would normally envisage three quarter pace to be? Or is my maths completely messed up?
The best definition I ever heard for determining 75% effort involves no calculation whatsoever. Whatever your best 100 time is, swim a 75 in that amount of time. :banana:
the problem with your math is each 25 would take 1/3 of your 100's time
so if you expand that out to 100
isn't it
4 x 1/3 = 4/3 or 133 1/3%
which is 33% more
time wise if you go 1:00 in the 100 free
wouldn't 75% effort or 25% slower be
1:15
The best definition I ever heard for determining 75% effort involves no calculation whatsoever. Whatever your best 100 time is, swim a 75 in that amount of time. :banana:
I don't think you can just plugg in numbers and calculate effort in % of times.
(it wasn't as confusing in my head as it is in written form :)
if I swim (what I feel to be) 80% or 90% 100 free. maybe my 80% is 1:20 and my 90% is 1:10 but my 100% race time is 1:00.9
Using just math I should be 90% at 1:07, 80% at 1:16
so maybe the 100-90% works better than 90-80%, but after that it seems hard to measure effort and time in linear %, there should be some kind of sloping factor.
I hold 1:20 for most of my distance swimming meaning (roughly 76% of my 100 time), but that would make my fastest 400 time 4:04 and it's only 4:41 and my practice times around 5:10-5:20.
does that mean I swim my 400 times at 90% even though I feel like I am only swimming 80%??
You look on the money to me... .75*80 seconds=60 seconds if you run the math backward.
Do what I do when you interval seems long: be grateful:bolt:
As to whether that's what your coach envisions when (s)he says three quarter pace, I have absolutely no idea:D
Great topic for discussion
Perhaps we should consider the two separate issues:
- Physiological response to exercise stress (i.e. heart rate, repirotory rate, lactic acid build up etc.)
- Power resistance "curve" provided by swimming activity
The power resistance "curve" for swimming activity would be where you could find the answer to the original question of a 3/4 pace swim to simulate competition effort.
Hydrodyanamic drag of a swimmer body through the water increases as the velocity squared. As a result, the power required to make a interval time will increase as the square of the relative change in time. Consider the following equations
F_drag = C_flow * V^2
V_swim = d_swim/t_interval
W_swim = F_drag * D_pool
P_swim = W_swim * t_interval
where:
F_drag - hydrodyamic drag of swimmer body through water
V_swim - swimmer velocity through water
d_swim - pool distance swum
t_interval - competition time or training pace interval
W_swim - work expenditure of swimmer. This quantity is directly related to required caloric intake to recover from swim workout
P_swim - power expenditure of swimmer. This quantity is related to swimmer bodies capability to convert chemical energy stores into usefull muscular power output
I put in the term C_flow as a constant that would represent an individuals flow resistance in the water. It considers skin friction, form drag and stroke efficiency. You would determine your personal C_flow number from swim tests. You might have one C_flow for sloppy swimming and one for high quality ;)
If you take all these equations and combine you could get the following:
P_race = C_flow * (d_swim^2 / t_race)
So if you consider C_flow and d_swim the same between train and race conditions and wanted an interval that was three quarter (75%) of your race speed power output you would just have.
t_train = t_race/0.75
You were correct in your original answer.
For me the challenge that engages me in those long sets of training intervals is working toward keeping efficiency high (make C_flow low) for strokes and turns and to simulate short periods of race conditions in training to monitor any changes in C_flow.
Happy swimming.
He brought his maths home.
Maths is his favorite subject.
His maths is improving.
He buys his maths supplies from the local maths supply warehouse, Maths Is Us. A rival chain, Maths R Us, was so roundly ridiculed by Europeans that it had no choice but to shut down. The former manager is in hospital.
I used to have a head for maths, but of late maths is flying out my ears. Wait, that is impossible. Maths is flying out one of my ears.
If a maths is cut in half and each piece regenerates, are you left with two mathses?
And so wiles away the waning hours of a long day spent looking at the maths in my checkbook. Given the negative numbers featured therein, the plural implications of "maths" seem particular cruel to me now. But perhaps I am being overly sensitive.
Perhaps some warm milk and a biscuit and bed, that's the ticket.
I don't precisely gauge percentages, I just guess the effort,
also the percent effort you swim at might not give you the same time differential
you might want to think about percent effort in terms of ranges
also your range expands or contracts depending upon
1) how many you're doing,
2) how much rest you're getting
3) how you're feeling that day Are you on or off? Feeling good or hurting?
4) how psyched you are, is a coach timing you, who's watching you, who's swimming beside you
5) what suit you're wearing
6) if you're starting from a push or from a dive
7) how rested are you? (tapered?)
8) how many swimmers in & beside your lane, (waves)
9) how far apart are you leaving? (drafting)
10) what pool you're in? &
11) set instructions (like 5 DK or breathe every 5 affect your performance)
here's a guess about my
scy range while in a B70, from a dive with decent rest
100% 48 - 51
095% 52 - 54
090% 55 - 58
085% 59 - 61
080% 62 - 65
as far as mathmatically figuring it out
take your time & multiply it by 1.25 for 25% slower
but I think about the effort I'm putting forth & try to be with in an acceptable range
Mathematically, how do you work out 'three quarter pace"?
Let's say (for the sake of easy calculations) your best time for an event is 1 minute. In practice, you want to go three quarter pace. So a 100% effort will result in a time of 60 seconds. A 75% effort should result in a longer time. My rudimentary maths tells me I should divide 100 by 75 and multiply the result by 60. That works out to 80 seconds, which is a minute and 20 seconds. Why does that sound much slower than what I would normally envisage three quarter pace to be? Or is my maths completely messed up?
Maths first. Grammars second.
Jim, I think it is we Americans who are incorrect with respect to the use of "math" or "maths." Outside of the US, it is my experience that most people (both native and non-native English speakers) will refer to mathematics as maths, not math like we say. Given that we never say "mathematic," it seems to me that we Americans are either incorrect in saying "math" or just staying true to our passion for efficiency by dropping the "s."
I still say math, though, and have two degrees in the said subject.
With respect to the question, I'd go with qbrain's formulas if you're so inclined. As for me, I just go a little slower by perceived effort when the coach asks us to back it off to a lower % of effort. The exact pace varies from day to day depending upon what's going on in my life and training.
