I started thinkng about this after swimming this morning at ASU and once again seeing that the 3 guards on duty were not in any of the chairs but instead were in the office texting and playing on duty.
So what happens if God forbid a swimmer is injured or dies in workout (I guess even if the guard is on duty)...can they sue the coach?
I know USMS has an insurance program for clubs and being to lazy wonder is anyone knows if it covers this?
I also wonder how many paidand/or volunteer coaches have any type of contract for this sort of thing?
Only if the swim coach's last name is Rockefeller or Forbes or Hilton or Onaisis. Most swim coaches aren't bringing home the Brinks Truck unless the coach's name is Bob "Money Machine" Bowman.
... Is it the coaches duty to watch the pool and save the athlete? Are the guards responsible for this?....
No. Yes.
... sometimes the guards do not watch for a while. The team is in the water when others are in the wadeing pool, so I assume the guards are the responsible ones?
If lifeguards are assigned to a pool facility, they are responsible for the safety of all persons at the facility, especially the swimmers. Some states require lifeguards be present at commercial facilities, but there are loopholes for lifeguard coverage. The loopholes typically only apply to adults, and you no doubt sign a waiver to this effect when you join a facility/club.
If you take an ARC WSI course you will find out that swim instructors are not responsible for preventing drownings... a certified lifeguard needs to be present for the class, and it cannot also be the instructor. There could be only one guard to cover all the swimmers in a pool, I believe it is up to the facility to determine coverage, but any facility director is going to want to protect themselves and provide enough guards for conditions expected. Typically, the rule is one guard per 25 swimmers in the water. YMMV.
At most facilities I'm familiar with, if guards were at the facility and not watching the water while people were swimming, heads would roll.
If you take an ARC Lifeguard class you will find out that while a guard is on duty ("on the stand"), they are allowed to do nothing but watch the water. (No talking to passers by, picking leaves out of the gutter, cell phones, i-pods, etc.)
It seems a shame that folks, especially qualified and well-meaning ones, who want to help with something like swim coaching are afraid to do so for reasons of liability.
Only if the swim coach's last name is Rockefeller or Forbes or Hilton or Onaisis. Most swim coaches aren't bringing home the Brinks Truck unless the coach's name is Bob "Money Machine" Bowman.
Most swim coaches are not loaded a la Forbes, but most do have assets that they should want to protect (savings, house, some other business, etc.) as well as other people who depend on them every day for their earnings. So a coach should certainly pay attention not only to reducing, rather than increasing, the risk of harm to his or her swimmers, but also to doing whatever is necessary to be sure that insurance covers the coach's activities in the case of a horrible event.
Unless the swim coach is the pool or facility manager he/she should not be responsible for the performance of the lifeguards.
I doubt Eddie Reese has any role in making sure the lifeguards at UT are sitting in their chairs watching swimmers. That is the responsbility of the swim center management. Wouldn't a pool run by ASU have similar operations?
Maybe at other pools the coach bears responsibility for pool operations but that seems unlikely to me.
As I can attest, law suits are painful because they are a nuisance. Coverage for swimming, practicing medicine, driving down the road, etc. is often adequate. It should not make you feel better that you are "covered" as that fact does not preclude anybody from filing a suit. The fact that you may be right and you have insurance to cover any incident is irrelevant. It's the 2-6 years of emotional hell and the bucks that go to lawyers that really sucks. Sleep tight.:bed:
As I can attest, law suits are painful because they are a nuisance. Coverage for swimming, practicing medicine, driving down the road, etc. is often adequate. It should not make you feel better that you are "covered" as that fact does not preclude anybody from filing a suit. The fact that you may be right and you have insurance to cover any incident is irrelevant. It's the 2-6 years of emotional hell and the bucks that go to lawyers that really sucks. Sleep tight.:bed:
Well said.
Yeah, any parent who had a kid drown because the coach sent the 15 year old lifeguard out to his car to retrieve his cell phone, saying "I've got the pool covered," really ought to just suck it up and say "That's life." Hate to inconvenience anyone with a pesky lawsuit over something as insignificant as the loss of a child.
This thread gives me the willies. I'm currently assisting with our summer league team. There are NO lifeguards on deck during our practices with sometimes up to 85 kids in the pool at one time. AND some of the younger ones start off barely knowing how to swim. The strange thing is that our summer league governing body (whose leadership thinks it rules the swimming universe) doesn't require lifeguards or ANY certifications for its coaches. I think I will be investigating both my coverage and the implementation of certified lifeguards on the deck during practices.
gobears - that is a frightening scenario. I'm surprised your HOA (if it's a neighborhood pool) or the pool ownership allows a team to practice without any sort of guard, not to mention the whole insurance debacle this would cause.
This thread gives me the willies. I'm currently assisting with our summer league team. There are NO lifeguards on deck during our practices with sometimes up to 85 kids in the pool at one time. AND some of the younger ones start off barely knowing how to swim. The strange thing is that our summer league governing body (whose leadership thinks it rules the swimming universe) doesn't require lifeguards or ANY certifications for its coaches. I think I will be investigating both my coverage and the implementation of certified lifeguards on the deck during practices.
You definitely may have a safety issue. You only need to worry about a suit if you or the governing body is worth a boat-load of money or if you are insured with a high dollar amount, as a lawyer's feigned altruism can only go so far to paying the billS:D.