I think we can all be certain that the suits are here to stay -- love them, hate them, it does not really matter -- Speedo, TYR and the others will not allow the suits to all over sudden disappear.
But, we as Masters swimmers have to make a decision about our own reasoning to compete -- why do we compete in swim meets ?
There are many reasons - social, participating in a sport beats the hell out of watching one on TV and so on --- but for me, 2 of the main reasons are the competition aspects. We obviously compete against other swimmers --- but more than maybe many other sports, we compete against ourselves. I can tell you my best 100 Free from every season over the last 30 years (10 of which I did not compete).
I have used most of the suits and did very well -- I set some personal bests and also achieved some record swims, but I have no idea how my times really compare to other seasons. I can keep telling myself that all that speedwork and lifting paid off - but I just don't know.
I like to give a golf comparison -- let's say you have a home course and you always shoot in the low 90s going from the Blue Tees --- well guess what, if you are going from the white tees you will probably average high 80s and going from the red you may get down to the mid to low 80s. But you are not a better player because of it. The LZR seems to be the "white tees" and the new Jaked suit may be the "red tees".
I think we really have to make a decision now to what matters more -- your personal records and history of swimming or the competition against other swimmers ? For me, this may change from meet to meet - but I must be able to stay honest with myself and be able to compare my times -- I do not want to be cheating myself.
Old generations suits (Fastskin Pro) only for: all major Masters meets (individual swims) except for Worlds. That means, I am ok to lose a few places in a meet, in order to know what my time really means. I could just go really old school -- but I think the older generation suits are pretty equal to shaving -- and they allow you to be "shaved" and swim fast in season, which is a huge plus.
LZR / Blue70 for: relays, Worlds and maybe some USS meets, if I am going for a time standard. I want to give any relay my fastest time possible - I swimming Worlds to win the title, so if others use the suits, I will have to do the same - if I go to USS meets, I may use them to get into the finals or to make a time standard for a big meet.
It may take some adjustments - but I think it will work --
Who is with me ?
I have always thought it is an odd result that the B70 will be banned but the LZR would not. From most accounts, the LZR is a faster suit. So the most performance enhancing suit, owned by a monopolist company, will continue to be legal while a slightly less fast one from a fledgling reputable company is banned? And all because the LZR has slightly less impermeable material, especially on top? Some swimmers think that is actually preferable in terms of body position ...
Follow the money...Speedo is a proud sponsor of FINA. Do you think its just a coincidence that FINA determined the maximum amount of non-permeable material in a suit can be 50%...which just happens to be what the LZR is...Hmmm
I disagree. There should be no asterisk. Yes, Auburn was the only team to wear the Jaked suit, but is there any evidence any other team even tried to get their hands on the Jaked?
I was kind of kidding about the asterisk. Auburn took advantage of the rules as they were in place at the time (but they were within the rules) and maybe they knew more about the benefits of the Jaked suits because of their European student athletes and alumni. I would suspect any team/swimmer that understood the benefits of Jaked probably could have ordered the Jaked suits provided they could make international wire transfers. I am sure teams and swimmers that knew the time benefit of Jaked suits would have ordered them so there definitely was a lack of knowledge of the Jaked suits outside of Auburn.
The transition period has its victors and its victims.
Tim
this forum blasted Vlad P for doping yet all those that blasted him wear tech suits. is there a difference? which form of cheating gives a better time drop, PEDs or tech suits? arent we all cheaters?
now swimming has been offically tainted, the one last clean sport, the sport we all grew up with that had a bunch of clean honest families participating.
ITS OVER FOLKS.
we as humans are our own worst enemies. we are imploding.
who really cares about any of this nonsense anymore...
we'll all be dead soon
I guess you were up late drinking to excess from existential angst again? Get a grip, there is a huge difference between legal and illegal conduct.
Paul,
I heartily agree about the money comment, and think it's a terrible result that B70 may be banned while the LZR gets off scot free ...
As to the straight arm recovery, I see your point. As a straight arm freestyler, I do feel it's hard to sustain over increased distance -- one reason I rarely swim anything over a 50 free! However, I can't sustain it with or without a B70. That's probably because I'm a broken down master, but nevertheless, it ain't helping me that way.
I think the B70 has a disproportionate impact in other ways too. I've always thought it helps people with poor body position and poor technique more, or those that are tall and/or overweight. Moreover, f you have a natural feel for the water, B70 can effect and/or hinder that somewhat and throw things off. And then there's the theory that it helps certain strokes more than others ...
I guess you were up late drinking to excess from existential angst again? Get a grip, there is a huge difference between legal and illegal conduct.
Paul,
I heartily agree about the money comment, and think it's a terrible result that B70 may be banned while the LZR gets off scot free ...
As to the straight arm recovery, I see your point. As a straight arm freestyler, I do feel it's hard to sustain over increased distance -- one reason I rarely swim anything over a 50 free! However, I can't sustain it with or without a B70. That's probably because I'm a broken down master, but nevertheless, it ain't helping me that way.
I think the B70 has a disproportionate impact in other ways too. I've always thought it helps people with poor body position and poor technique more, or those that are tall and/or overweight. And then there's the theory that it helps certain strokes more than others ...
Do you think Austin Staab kicks 15 yds underwater for all 4 lengths but on the last one after his breakout he swims the last 10 yds without taking a breath and goes 44.18 in the 100 fly...without one of these suits?
Little has been discussed about this feat but it may be one of the more incredible things ever seen in our sport.
I'd like to throw out this question:
To those wearing the B70 (or the LZR or Jaked, to be fair) would you swim in a major competition without it (if you currently own one)?
Why not?
Karen, count me in as answering your question. Yes. I wore a poly for half my swims at a USS Auburn meet in 2009. What's your point with that? I was slower but still near or better than my times as a kid (untapered and ill). I was not as fast as when I wear a B70. I won Nationals in 2004 with a $30 dolphin suit in the 50 meter fly after a 12 year break while my competition surrounded me in tech suits (I also got 2nd and 3rd places in my other 3 events). And?
I'd love to see the people who are now in the USMS TT (where they hadn't been before, ever), breaking records, swimming "stupid fast" where they hadn't before, take off the B70 and LZR and swim. I am astounded at the number of people (that I swim with, or know of) with huge time drops who say "it isn't the suit". I keep hearing in many places, "I trained really hard," or "The suit can't swim for me," or "It's not cheating." If all of the above is true then why is there such controversy?
And I've heard people say the exact opposite. I do think the tech suits swim for me. However, I train in a poly (which is about 95% of my swimming experience) with the SR I/ National kids which to Ehoch's point is my benchmark for being *honest* with myself. If anyone is concerned about whether or not they are *cheating* themselves, come jump on in with the SWAT national team for a couple of months. The water's fine!
Guys ( and girls) - it's a discussion forum. I only express my very subjective opinions and try to see what other people think on the same subject - nobody said anything about world peace and nobody is losing any sleep over this.
About the progress argument --- swimming is different than cycling and tennis and many other sports. You are racing against the clock as much as you are racing against other swimmers. I can swim a 50 Free in my pool and compare exactly against the 50 Free Mike Ross did last week and compare it exactly against the swim I did last year. There are not many other sports where you can do that. I have no idea if Rafa Nadal is playing better this year than last year. But I can tell you exactly that Bousquet swam a 21.53 last year and now swam a 20.94 - I don't think he took it easy last year.
So if I am want to place as high as possible at Nationals and swim the fastest possible time, I will run to my bank and send 400 Euro to Italy and pray that the Jaked will get here in time - because people are not just dropping a few tenth they are dropping seconds - and I don't see that as a bad thing - that is the price of staying competitive in the current situation. I actually thought about it - but I just came to a different decision.
The most common feedback I get from experienced swimmers when they try the Blue 70 - a big smile and "this should not be legal".
