Still, the fact is that YOU take supplements and break world records, yet you decry others for taking supplements?
I don't give a flying fart who takes what supplements. But, I don't know a single person who takes them that doesn't realize they are on their own with them. It is well known that the supplement industry is full of fraud, deceit, unregulated, and this point is absolutely driven home to elite athletes. If you know a single person subject to drug testing, they will let you know this. But, apparently, when someone who is tested comes up positive they proclaim ignorance.
JH's lawyer has made a few statements the he has a good lead on where it came from and plans to present evidence at her hearing, why not wait for him to put his cards on the table and then make a judgment?
Her lawyer is the same guy who came up with the "Chimera defense" for Tyler Hamilton (from Wikipedia: "a chimera is an animal that has two or more different populations of genetically distinct cells that originated in different zygotes; if the different cells emerged from the same zygote, it is called a mosaicism. Chimerism is rare in human beings: there have been only about 40 reported cases.")
Jacobs is a former triathlete who has also defended Marion Jones, Floyd Landis, and Tim Montgomery. Here's an article about him:
"For athletes accused of taking drugs, a Perry Mason of their own"
"Attorney Howard Jacobs, who has defended athletes from Marion Jones to US swimmer Jessica Hardy, believes the system is tilted too much toward antidoping agencies..."
features.csmonitor.com/.../
:blah::blah::blah::blah::blah:
Where is the proof.....you make these unequivical statements....but have nothing to back it up.
Doesn't have anything to do with whether I like your answer or not....you still refuse to put up your proof.....
Piss cup, two positive samples, that is the proof. What more proof do you require? Three times I have answered your question. It won't change no matter how many times you ask. Should you ask again, my answer will be piss cup.
What I want to see is their proof that this actually happened KNOWINGLY!!!
Piss cup, 4th time, won't change, not even if you ask again.
I respected your argument about your hero and idol Torres that she has never tested positive and that is the litmus test. Only now do I realize that it is not a litmus test of cheating, it is simply the first of many tests that lying cheating dopers must flunk in order for there to be a partial acknowledgment of wrongdoing, and then that evaporates when their attorney spew off dribble you might find slightly plausible.
Once a person tests positive, the case is closed in my book. But, we need all sides of the argument. After all, as Smith says, you guys keep the therapists in business.
According to others here.....she KNOWINGLY LIED and KNOWINGLY CHEATED. What I want to see is their proof that this actually happened KNOWINGLY!!!
Quite a game of semantics going on here. What do you mean by "knowingly"? Did she take something (even what she considered a legal supplement) knowingly? Some are arguing that even if she tested positive because she took something that was tainted (which is probably a long-shot but could have happened) then she still knew there was a risk. She's been told over and over that supplements are dangerous and she knowingly chose to take them anyway. Somehow she ingested clenbuterol. Could she possibly be just plain stupid or foolish instead of a liar? Perhaps. Either way she is a "cheat" since she competed with something that wasn't supposed to be in her system. Either way, she comes out looking pretty bad.
I also detect a bit of hypocrisy here in the holier-than-thou statements about how any swimmer is an idiot for taking supplements. Some of the people making these statements are the same people who have openly talked here about taking supplements like creatine themselves, and some of these people are Masters world record holders. Have you had all of your supplements tested? Is this a case of the pot calling the kettle black? Yeah, I know, "it's only Masters swimming", :blah::blah:. Still, the fact is that YOU take supplements and break world records, yet you decry others for taking supplements?
Are you kidding me?
I never took a single supplement when I was swimming college and during the time I was training for the 84' trials....I was very aware even back then what the consequences were and was not willing to take ANY risk of making the team and getting booted.
As for being an old fart swimming masters I have openly acknowledged trying creatine...and if you or anyone else ever has a concern about my possibly using something illegal send the tester unannounced any day, any time...I'll even pay for the test results.
Is that Holier than thou enough for you? :mooning:
Gosh, it sure sounds like a few of us have hair in our ears---
Huh, what did you say?
I said, it sounds like a few of us have hair in our ears---
Huh, I can't hear you---
Never mind---
And on our backs...and its turning gray and expanding!
Everybody here that takes supplements is a KNOWING Cheater!!!!!!!
You heard it here first.....................
How many of the supplement takers here actually send them out to be tested? Answer.....(I am guessing) is 0
Wow. I think you have a reading comprehension problem... I don't believe I was talking about anyone here was I?
I suppose you think it's possible that clen was found in JH's urine but that doesn't mean she cheated. So her swims were then possibly legal? I guess you also think that she could possibly come out of this whole thing looking like an angel. You don't seem to acknowledge that, whether she knew she ingested clen or had no idea she was taking a tainted form of one of 12 supplements (that USA Swimming warned her about) she looks either guilty of doping or incredible foolishness (I'd venture to say, recklessness).
