Originally posted by Paul Smith
Here's the deal folks...forget about weights...if you REALLY want to make a significant break through in your swimming relative to competition stop swimming for 4-8 weeks and go to kick only workouts...as you ease back into swimming you will have the opportunity to "learn" how to integrate a new and powerful element to your stroke...something that 90% of the swimmers I see competing do not do well....
This really caught my attention. I seem to have been hearing this a lot lately: people coming back after a shoulder op, doing kick only workouts and then having their best seasons ever.
I don't doubt the authenticity of it either. I am just interested on what is actually going on. Why should this be the case?
Has anyone ever scientifically measured the amount the kick contributes to forward propulsion? I mean ratio wise, compared to the arms, what would it be? 80% arms : 20% legs?
What about the swimmers who are great kickers in workouts but can't translate it into faster swimming?
How do we actually integrate the kick into our swimming so that it becomes a new and powerful element to our stroke as Paul suggests?
Would it be fair to say that a big part of the improvement these (post op/ focus on kicking )swimmers achieve can be attributed to the strengthened core which is a result of the additional kicking. In other words more credit given to the strengthened core than increased forward propulsion.
I don't know. I just throw out these ideas for discussion.
Syd
Former Member
i think that's great and
the faster you get the harder it is to drop
how's your SDK
some swimmers are doing SDKs in 500's
ande
Thanks Ande.
SDK's? What SDK's? They are atrocious/ non-existant.
Hubby video taped me. I know what to work on next. :doh:
Firby and I had a few conversations about the two waves, The bow wave and the wave that followed the swimmer. The one that we thought gave lift and assisted when we kicked.
Geochuck:
What does that mean?
Is kick propulsion added on top of the propulsion generated by the arms? It seems to me there is propulsion from the kick beyond what is needed for balance.
I watch this famous race which shows just how hard they are kicking.
www.youtube.com/watch
From the layman's point of view:
Let's assume the speed effect from the kick is not great--for a moment.
Everyone would agree that kicking hard sucks the life out of you; overdo it too early and it's "jello legs" for the rest of the way or until you recover...either way you feel it and or have to reduce your pace.
So back to my point, kicking hard in practice will help your "engine" get used to running more efficiently, or in pain, and allow your upper body to work harder for longer. So even if direct power is not provided by the legs, I feel that there would be at least a "knock on" effect to the system at large because of the conditioning.
Now kicking hard and not being a good technical swimmer may not add much and may even make things worse if it disrupts the flow of water over the body. For a good swimmer though, and all the way up to an elite swimmer, this is not likely to be the case.
Good kicking has to help otherwise nobody would do it in races; if you work on it and it gives you a second /100 yards, over a 500 or 1000 that's very significant.
I think you need both a vessel and an engine. Just kicking all the time or wearing fins all the time will not help but hammering your legs once a week or perhaps more will surely add to your swim.
Back to the experts...
It doesn't seem like doing anything "all the time" is a good idea.
I find it's my arms I can't feel at the end of a race.
My :2cents:,
I've started kicking more in practice to see if it'll help. I started about 5 weeks ago and started with 250yds. I'm now kicking 1000yds 3x a week, mostly dolphin kicking but do about 3-400yds flutter. For me it's gotten better/faster, and I've gone from a 25sec 25yd dolphin kick to 16-18 sec.
I guess for me, initially I couldn't see how kicking could help as I was a poor kicker, but now that I've seen progress, who knows? And it has taken some experimentation with how fast, where to place feet, how much bend in the knees, activating core, etc.
Along with funky, the past 3 months I have been kicking more and taking spin 2-3X/week. Not only has my kick improved but my endurance with kicking hard has improved. If you can kick harder longer you will see your times improve.
Swimmers need to develop amazing kicks that pertain to their races
Sprinters couldn't care less about
how far or fast they can kick for 5 or even 10 minutes
they don't care about the fastest interval the can repeat 100 kicks on
but they are keenly interested in how fast they can kick for
15, 25, 50, 75 and 100 yards
or what pace they can hold on sets like
6 x 50 k fast on 2:00
fly & flutter kicking speed is the result of:
Body
+ foot proportions and foot / ankle flexibility
+ body shape
+ leg strength and conditioning
+ hyperextended knees, many fast kickers / swimmers have hyper extended knees
+ equipment / suit worn: the type of suit a swimmer wears makes a difference
Technique
+ kicking technique
(some swimmers have better feel for the water with their feet)
+ body position
Mind
+ mental stuff:
self image,
drive,
focus,
expectations,
pain tolerance,
determination,
IPS (the athletes ability to get in Ideal Performance State)
splitting
All I can say is hubby taped my races and it's very apparent that I've got plenty of work to do. :whiteflag:
That's scary considering your current times! How much are you swimming per week?
Want a grudge match in the 500 free? My masters PB is a 5:01, so I've got ten seconds on you, but I don't think I could swim a 5:12 today. My goal for this season--like every season--is to go under 5:00.
:2cents:
The past two weekends, I have swum the 100 free in meets. Last weekend, last event (of three) in a deep pool w/ bulkhead, warm air, wore aquablade jammers, and ride the wake of a guy who went 47.82, and went 53.54 myself.
This weekend, in a deep pool, but shallow lane, concrete/metal wall, warm air, speedo and racing the guy next to me, I went a 53.8.
BOTH times, I felt like the SDK on my dive and subsequent transition kicking were AWESOME, catching a lot of water, very efficient and very effective. I was able to maintain a strong kick throughout, nailing all turns w/ at least 1 SDK, and then bringing it home hard.
My 100 free history shows that I do not often make it to 53.99 or under outside of a Zone or National Championship meet, and to do it two weekends in a row. I'd say the kicking has something to do with this.
Can you please post this on youtube...? :drink:
Yes, that would be good so you could see my super cute 5 year old daughter and wife counting for me. That might distract you from the bludgeoning I took from She-man.
It might also give Stud some inspiration to move up 6 or 7 heats in the 500.
