Dara Torres-Amazing

Huh? Whatcha saying there? An eyewitness account is direct evidence, not hearsay evidence. It may not be as reliable as circumstantial evidence, but is completely admissible. Hearsay evidence is unverified info heard or received from another that is not personally known. For example, if someone repeated an eyewitness account that they heard from the eyewitness, that would be hearsay. I actually appreciate it when someone calls me out for talking out my :mooning:. I do not know much about law. My original point was that there was at least some evidence to implicate both Clemens and Jones. Whether McNamee is lying will be up to someone else to determine and Jones was implicated by association with a coach known for doping. There has been no evidence of any sort to implicate Torres except for the fact that she appears to be getting ripped! I know some women who are 5 to 10 years older that may not be able to swim as fast as Dara, but they certainly are as fit and ripped.

I doubt a 41 year old woman would risk her life by taking harmful substances. She looks that way from proper nutrition and years of hard work. Maybe/maybe not....as has been brought up many times here and other blogs what Dara has achieved is as significant a milestone in sports as the first sub 4:00 minute mile, Beamon's long jump, etc....simply because no male or female athlete of that age has ever been the "best" as she has recently done in the 50 free with er AR. Physically the extreme changes in her build particularly from 2000 to 2007 are worth questioning and understanding how/why....again we are seeing a first if you will and maybe it will now become commonplace to see middle age female athletes achieving the same results and bodies. Interesting that I'm typing this in a hotel room in Vegas with FOX running a story about that found that as many as 8% of high school girls are taking steroids...the vast majority to achieve a "look" vs. for sports...its fine to be optimistic that people are generally "good" and not cheaters....but sadly the reality is a significant amount of people in our society cheat.

as many as 8% of high school girls are taking steroids...the vast majority to achieve a "look" vs. for sports Wow. I'm surprised that's the kind of look a teenaged girl would want to achieve.

So how does that work? I always assumed steroids didn't really do much good unless you were working out while using.

Kirk, it's not for the bulk its for the fat burning. God forbid they have to watch what they eat or actually exercise.

American culture... a pill for everything. Occasionally we are even forced to import our pills from the UK.

Why are you telling us this? What happens in Vegas stays in Vegas Paul!! ;) Sadly the most "excitment" we've had outside the convention was sleeping in this morning vs. swimming with Vic again! Another comment made on the FOX story about the high school girls was about Clemmons wife taking hgh to get ready for the swimsuit photos...I guess if mom thinks its ok why not eh?

HGH If a small person that used HGH to get themselves to be within the average size zone be considered a druggie in your opinion. I happen to know a family that was what we called little people that had the injections. I consider a druggie anyone who chooses to use a banned substance or chooses to go to an organization such as balco for a product that is not yet recognized and therefore not approved or illegal that will enhance their performance....anyone with legitimate medical needs working with a doctors supervision has nothing to do with this discussion George.

What if it is not true and he is proven to be a liar. I would love for him to take a lie detector test. Huh? Whatcha saying there? An eyewitness account is direct evidence, not hearsay evidence. It may not be as reliable as circumstantial evidence, but is completely admissible. Hearsay evidence is unverified info heard or received from another that is not personally known. For example, if someone repeated an eyewitness account that they heard from the eyewitness, that would be hearsay.

Chris Stevenson, Comparing Susan with Dara is not that good of a comparison. Note, Susan made her Olympic teams in individual events not just relays. Susan is very naturally strong and talented, but she has not transformed her body as dramatically as Dara. Susan is respectably close to her career best times in the 100 ***, but is not going to top 8 let alone win ..... let alone set an Amercian Record in the event. Susan appears to be the first real masters swimmer (with a masters swimmers lifestyle and attitude) to be able to qualify and race at the trials. Susan is doing something phenomenal. Frankly, I am more interested in Susan's performance at the trials than's Dara's performance. I find Susan's swims stunning given her routine and daily demands....... despite the fact that she DQ'd my son at the last meet in Loveland, CO !!!! Dara's phyique and accomplishments look totally different to me. I would not compare the two as one supporting the other. John Smith They do look physically different. What if Susan trained like Dara? Susan is not the first real masters swimmer to swim at Trials. Wally Dicks has done that.