Coach Encroachment

I think a swimmer needs to do what they feel is best. However, that being said, I do think it is a problem for swimmers to receive private coaching on the side...without prior knowledge of their current coach. If their team coach is decent, they are very used to and have a plan for that particular swimmer. That coach understands the subtlties of their stroke. They understand the whole person. They may have them mastering one aspect of a stroke even though the whole thing isn't pulled together yet as part of an individualized learning plan. Going to a camp for a week or seeing a private coach can undo or negate all that hard work. I think there is also an issue of lack of communication. If a swimmer feels they need to have a stroke clinic, they should go to their coach first. I think most of these swimmers are just going out and signing up for things without working with the primary coach first. Although, there are plenty of cases where a swimmer will get more out of a clinic or private coach because they are simply more talented than their primary team coach. I think when this is the case the swimmer needs to let their primary team coach know beforehand and ask how they can work it into the season (or off-season) plan. That way there can hopefully be some sort of unification of coaching methods and it will really benefit the swimmer rather than two different coaching approaches. I'm sure a lot of the upset comes from things such as a swimmer contradicting their primary coach saying "coach so-and-so wants me to do it this way instead". At best it's an ego hit to the coach and the swimmer improves, at worst, the swimmer is destroying and working against their season plan, contradicting the coach, and not swimming as well as they could be. Absolutely swimmers need to try things on and see what works for them, coaches, technique, teams, etc. But they also need to blend advice and not be contraditory. Not many kids or teenagers, or even many adults are good at remembering they don't know everything.

Wondering about USS coaching. If a swimmer is on a particular team, is it permissible or desirable for them to get private coaching/lessons elsewhere or attend clinics in addition to attending all team practices? Heard of a couple coaches recently who went ballistic when their swimmers took private lessons from another coach not affiliated with their team (not affiliated with any other team either, just a private coach). Is this not politically correct for USS swimmers? Fort, this is a great question you pose here. I think a lot of the programs in the DC area (I live there too) are overcrowded and I'm always concerned that my boys aren't getting the proper attention from the coach. I would probably let the coach know why I was taking my swimmer for some private work as a courtesy (maybe wake them up a bit too). If they felt it wasn't necessary then they need to address why I was looking. One of their arguments may be that they don't want the kids to get conflicting information. But I would think they could be professional about it and not go ballistic. I send my kids to a swim camp in the summer - their coach actually encourages a second point of view and change of scenery. Not a lot different. By the way, let me know if you'd like to chat about the allergy thing offline. I'm a bit of a lurker and see that you train at GMU. I had to abandon GMU I think because of the bromine. I've had to start my "comeback" in the wonderful chlorine county rec pools - but I battled that for a long time.

Fortress, do your kids swim for the mason mokas? These are all great thoughts guys. Thanks so much. Warren: No, another team. I know lots of kids on the Makos though, including my coaches' kids. Everyone: I haven't done this yet, and I love my kids' coaches. They're really fabulous. My worry is more what Doug was pointing out. I don't hover at practice, but I have seen some practices (a few times I'm swimming in a lap lane) and I have spoken at length to all the coaches on the team over time. So I know they focus on drills and technique as much as any USS team. But the programs are quite large here and it's hard to get a lot of individualized attention. And my main swimming kid is so outgoing that she's always hammering her coaches with questions about how to improve her technique. Which at least is a bit better than the naturally quieter kids that sit silently by or remain confused. I am considering sending her to a swim camp, and I have solicited input, some of which I posted on post #2 of the swim camp thread. Doug, I'd love to hear where you send your kids, if you want to PM me. I don't think her coaches would object to a camp. But I imagine it would depend on the timing. If it's sort of between seasons and does not unduly interfere with training, I don't think, or at least hope, they would mind. Seems a little severe. I would certainly discuss it with them. I think Michelle's point is valid. I think kids can get conflicting advice. I am curious about this topic because I have heard a lot of gossip lately about coaches being pissed about their swimmers receiving other coaching. It's the conflicting advice issue (e.g., how far is the outsweep on breaststroke?), but I agree with Warren that it may be a bit proprietary too. Obviously, if they are getting coached by someone from a rival team, that's a big no no. But that wasn't the case in the stories I heard. And the coach had excellent credentials. But I do have to wonder. It seems like apart from the team practices a little individual attention wouldn't hurt. When my main swimming kid just swam summer league in the summer not LC, she always had private lessons. Now, it was with the coaches of her summer league team. But she needed the additional stroke assistance. Especially as a young kid. I've spoken to former college swimmers about this issue, and they seemed to go to camps and have individual instruction. Tom: There is nothing in my nose. I have no sinus infection at the moment. I am going to take Peter Cruise's advice and abandon allergy shots for awhile. I think they're ruining my eyes. Or maybe Doug is right and it's the bromine. On that score, when I missed practices for 6 weeks because of shoulder and sinus infection issues, when I went back my coach said, "Have you been swimming with another team?" Jeez. No, just at the county rec center on my own where I could doing vessel shaping .... School year thing.

Fort: are you pulling my leg here? I suppose you are asking if this is legal or not and I am not part of USS Swimming, but until a person signs a contract (hey, you're the lawyer), can't they get info/help from any source they choose? I mean I wouldn't much care that my coach gets upset if I need to seek out my questions and/or get help from others, and if he/she were a coach who wanted the best for me and not delivering, that coach shouldn't get too upset other than the fact that that person would probably be embarrassed they weren't delivering what the swimmer needed. I am not, folks, chastisizing any coaches. All of mine were superb but served different purposes. My gosh, in ice skating, they change coaches all the time due to "creative differences." What's next if this is true?

I would think the coach would be happy you sneezed on someone else! :rofl: Oh- it wasn't you? I agree with Islandsox. This is an ego thing, not a propriety issue. Not everyone has all of the answers. If a patient of mine wants another opinion, I don't get all huffy and demand they never come back. What kind of fungus is growing in your nose, anyhow? That avatar practically looks wet.

If I were the coach I would be kind of insulted. If the swimmer came back with a different stroke technique than I teach Id be mad. Id be ok with it if it were a really good coach.

I think there is also an issue of lack of communication. Non-threatening communication can never hurt. If you can tell a coach what you need and what you're after, they shouldn't have an issue with it.

Warren, I see the point you are making but as a coach, that person must realize that they may not have all the answers even if they think they do and especially if they say they do. And how do you tell a coach is good or not? One of my best coaches was an unknown in the Coaches World, but her Masters Club had an awful lot of speed demons (sprinters and flyers). And she had a quality I respect of her today: she would actually encourage swimmers to go to this club or that club because she had taken them as far as she could and she could see their frustrations. And she was also an ex-Olympian. Donna

Fortress, do your kids swim for the mason mokas?

Our USS team actually suggests some specific camps to the parents of swimmers...Stanford University is home to one that they speak very highly of. EDIT: Our coaches do frown on parents giving race day stroke advice though. Apparently there have been some parents trying to make alterations to their kids stroke in a last ditch effort to make them faster. I am sure you can guess how that winds up. I think a good coach should be pro anything that is going to make one of their athletes a better swimmer or a better person in general. If they fall short in this respect then something is wrong in my book.