There is nothing that wrecks a good swimming related thread faster than getting into a discussion about message board etiquette. So here is a thread that people can use discuss topics related to what should and should not be posted on the message boards while allowing the other threads to stay on topic.
It seems to me that there is a spectrum of opinion on off-topic posting. On one end of the spectrum people think that threads are a mechanism specifically designed to allow people to carry on discussions on different topics and that we would all be well served if changes in topic were just done in new threads. On the other end of the spectrum people think that people should be able to post anything they want anywhere they want and that any suggestion to the contrary is censorship, a personal attack, or simply control freakish.
Pretty much everyone falls somewhere between these two extremes. Very few people object to a humorous quip inserted here and there in an otherwise serious discussion. Very few people would actually advocate that people be able to liberally sprinkle potentially offensive posts randomly through all the threads.
Have you ever been at a party where someone has decided that this is the right time and place to have a big argument or screaming match with someone? Has it ever contributed to the general enjoyment of the rest of the people there?
I would argue that posts that are essentially expressions of anger and/or are essentially personal attacks have no place on the board. They don't contribute anything positive and generally turn off 99% of the people reading the boards. Even if it seems that someone else has attacked you, does it really help anything to post an angry response?
I personally don't see the problem with starting a new thread when one wants to make an off-topic comment, a little cut and paste and/or a link makes it easy enough to carry the context into the new thread. Why is it essential to be able to carry on an unrelated discussion in a thread where some people are trying to carry on a discussion on a particular topic?
Anyone can feel free to put me on ignore as well. :groovy: Life is too short to be overly boring every single sentence. So I'll stay on topic and also zing Paul Smith. Others I am prepared to be very tolerant of.
Consider it done. :thhbbb: :thhbbb: :thhbbb:
I subscribe to several other internet discussion forums for topics ranging from travel, cars, and music. This is the only forum where I have seen such a strong deviation from the focus topic: swimming. Some forums have moderators that are way too protective and close/move threads for the slightest variance. I think there should be some middle ground.
One of the other forums I read occasionally deals with Saturn cars. The goal of the forum is to help owners and potential owners find ways around problems, hopefully not deal with problems in the first place. The mods do an excellent job with either deleting posts or simply moving them to a more appropriate sub-forum. The last thing I want to see when I'm looking at the Saturn-->Models-->Vue forum is about how the vehicle changed someone's lovelife for the better (or worse). Does that make sense? I have found some excellent tidbits about defects and recalls that have saved me money. They do have forums that deal with the annual meetup, local events, etc.
Perhaps there is a place for the true non-swimming things on this forum somewhere, but it is really up to the administrator and mods to determine if and where. Of course it would be great to involve the entire USMS membership with these decisions, but that really isn't practical.
I've been a member of the USMS forums for over 5 years, and have seen them go through some huge changes. At first it didn't seem like anyone was even here, so almost any post was welcome. We've gone through some growing pains along the way. Some posters have been banned, people came and went, but there are still some excellent posts that I learn more about swimming from.
You girl!
Oh....and I've decided that I'm putting all breastrokers on my ignore list! :thhbbb:
There are breaststrokers that aren't on your ignore list? Why wait, ignore all breaststrokers today. That's going to be my new platform for when I run for Ms. Masters Swimmer USA. Oh, and world peace.
you should keep reading Dorothy to get a full sense of what happened rather than rush to judgement off of a few posts. The fighting was shortlived and possibly a catalyst for the comedy that ensued.
Actually I think this is actually Lindsay's point. Reading the first page made me not want to read the rest. I perused a couple more pages, and it indeed had good information, although I am not going to any camps, which is probably why I did not open it in the first place.
As this thread continues, I notice some folks talking about "many" and generalizing that most people here want........
I think that "most" is actually a small group, and if there were truly a poll of the 800 posters on February 1, you would find that the more vocal posters are in the minority.
Still, I find this a useful board, and amusing board, and I always take certain posts, and posters with a grain of salt. I am quite certain that I would like all of them if I met in person. It is the nature of internet boards, to go off topic and to sometimes get snarky amongst the good material.
And now my dog is glaring at me, so I MUST get her out.
Personally it seems that his thread has run it course and we now need some time to see if the increased awareness of the various viewpoints results in a positive change to the board.
Another suggestion is that in addition to taking advantage of threads to let everyone partake in their own style of conversation with the minimum of interference, we apply a healthy dose of forgive and forget. In my view it is very disruptive when a disagreement in one thread is then brought up in several subsequent threads. When one thread goes bad, leave it there. Let's do that here, we now have an opportunity to move on with a new awareness and respect for one another.
Personally it seems that his thread has run it course and we now need some time to see if the increased awareness of the various viewpoints results in a positive change to the board.
Another suggestion is that in addition to taking advantage of threads to let everyone partake in their own style of conversation with the minimum of interference, we apply a healthy dose of forgive and forget. In my view it is very disruptive when a disagreement in one thread is then brought up in several subsequent threads. When one thread goes bad, leave it there. Let's do that here, we now have an opportunity to move on with a new awareness and respect for one another. posted by Lindsay
Thanks Lindsay for the thread and the kind words....I know we don't always agree (you and me)...but I respect your sense of civility and your efforts to try and solve some of these problems.
Ditto to what Rich said about Ande too....thanks for the great post Ande....I hope some of the new posters here will decide to stay b/c it would be a terrible shame if some of this bad stuff drives away new posters.....I really like the vast majority of the new posters! I hope everyone here can feel welcome...I am sorry for my previous bad behavior (of various sorts) and I will take a lot of what was said here to heart and be more conscious of other posters as Lindsay and others have suggested....I hope others will also do the same.
Newmastersswimmer
p.s. I'm sorry if this posting looked like an attempt to get the last word here.....I just don't want to see a mass exodus of new posters over this thats all.
Mortal was in refrence to non-olympic swimmers such as myself.
Though you and others would like the world to believe that appreciation=worship (in the case of TI), it does not
I don't believe that it was the "heat" of the kitchen that was unbearable, but rather the lack of topic related discussion.....which in this case is message board etiquette....so I will refrain from biting sarcasm for now.
You still haven't named a senior elite swimmer that swims TI. I am not saying it doesn't have its benefits. All I am saying is that I do NOT believe there is one and only one right way to swim. Look at the technique variations in an Olympic final. Those are the cream of the crop and yet they all use different techniques. What I didn't like was the insinuation that how I learned to swim was wrong because I don't "swim like a fish". I've had several very good coaches look at my strokes, watch film of them underwater and make suggestions, give corrections and drills for me. They looked at my body type, strengths, and weaknesses and have customized my strokes accordingly.
I do not believe TI is right for everyone nor do I believe it is not right for anyone. I think if Terry kept his explanations a tad shorter and less technical he would have a lot more people interested.
You know, I think everyone has made their various points. Everyone is trying to be better at being relevant, tolerant, selective, considerate etc. Why don't we put a voluntary lock on this now and get on with the Forums. Thank you Lindsay for putting the question out here. There are lots of topics out there to participate or lurk in. Let's get to it.
As long as people are clarifying things...
1) Contrary to what Islandox said...I don't feel that Gull, Terry, and Geek were the only posters of value around here. Actually, I made specific mention that there were still several dynamite swimmers on this forum. Far too many things are being misunderstood and/or taken out of context.
2) I don't see "hot tubs, wine, dinner, lunch, and basically harmless jokes and sexual innuendo. I am not against some humor as many of you can attest to but I think the sexual nature of many of the posts around here was completely out of line" as a personal attack on anybody. It was intended to display my displeasure with the nature and content of the posts in question. If I want to make an attack on one's character, what I consider to be a personal attack, it will be quite clear.
Lastly, is anything short of a compliment now a personal attack? Please clarify.
