There is nothing that wrecks a good swimming related thread faster than getting into a discussion about message board etiquette. So here is a thread that people can use discuss topics related to what should and should not be posted on the message boards while allowing the other threads to stay on topic.
It seems to me that there is a spectrum of opinion on off-topic posting. On one end of the spectrum people think that threads are a mechanism specifically designed to allow people to carry on discussions on different topics and that we would all be well served if changes in topic were just done in new threads. On the other end of the spectrum people think that people should be able to post anything they want anywhere they want and that any suggestion to the contrary is censorship, a personal attack, or simply control freakish.
Pretty much everyone falls somewhere between these two extremes. Very few people object to a humorous quip inserted here and there in an otherwise serious discussion. Very few people would actually advocate that people be able to liberally sprinkle potentially offensive posts randomly through all the threads.
Have you ever been at a party where someone has decided that this is the right time and place to have a big argument or screaming match with someone? Has it ever contributed to the general enjoyment of the rest of the people there?
I would argue that posts that are essentially expressions of anger and/or are essentially personal attacks have no place on the board. They don't contribute anything positive and generally turn off 99% of the people reading the boards. Even if it seems that someone else has attacked you, does it really help anything to post an angry response?
I personally don't see the problem with starting a new thread when one wants to make an off-topic comment, a little cut and paste and/or a link makes it easy enough to carry the context into the new thread. Why is it essential to be able to carry on an unrelated discussion in a thread where some people are trying to carry on a discussion on a particular topic?
There are a variety of reasons why viewers do not post. In my case it is primarily lack of time. Arising before 5 am to swim (Not with a group for the past 16 years. I can understanding perfectly the need to connect with other swimmers), heading off to a full time and demanding job, attempting to maintain some sort of family and social life and assisting an aging parent does not leave much time for frequent or thoughtful posting. My time on the forum is limited to 5 and 10 minute breaks when I must get some down time at work. I don't believe that simply because someone is not a frequent poster means that they do not have a vested interest in the forum. That would disenfranchise a large number of non-posting viewers.
I was disappointed, but not surprised, to seeing selected comments from my original post taken out of context. I had already stated that I liked getting to know fellow forum members through the non-swimming related discussions. I also said that it didn't have to all swimming, all the time. I said I had no problem with a bit of off topic conversation or humor. Yet I ended up seeing myself in the responses as an intolerant, humorless, swim-only robot. By golly, I sure didn't recognize myself!
Mentioning posters that you miss does not elevate them to demi-god status nor does it diminish those who have continued to post. I'm not sure where that implication came from. But I do think the forum would be a better place with the continued participation of Terry, Gull and Geek and anyone else who may have recently left in frustration.
What is frustrating for me is when I have a very limited amount of time to peruse the forum and encounter a long series of back and forth postings that are primarily inside info between the frequent posters. It's sort of like being on the outside of a clique looking in.
The point I was trying to make (and obviously I did it very poorly) is that there's a very large audience out here who do not post. But we must have an interest in the forum or we wouldn't keep coming back. I don't pretend to know the interests of all of the non-posting viewers. That was a poor choice of words on my part which will surely happen when you are forced by time to rush your own posting. For that I apologize. I guess all that I'm asking is that the rest of us non-posters be kept in mind when the thread veers off to, for lack of a better word, a more exclusionary clique-like nature.
I just want to remind EVERYONE that it is hard to understand people on posts. Tone and intention are hard to understand. All that said, I feel like this board goes in cycles sometimes very silly with lots of banter other times more seriously focused.
Ande made some great points. The bottom line is we are all human we all have our likes and dislikes strengths and weaknesses and can have our feelings hurt. I think that gets lost online.
I think most posters that are in the obnoxious and silly category (I know that is where you all put me) have also posted on serious threads and have either asked good questions or given good advice. Most people are complex and should not be categorized and simply being a jokster or always serious and anti-NSR.
Thanks for reminding me of all of this ...
What I said is mean? Please. :dunno:
I was not referring to your post....just the fact that Sweetgirl, a new poster, came into the middle of all this, saw some of the comments and now will probably stop posting.
Hmmmm...
Interesting thread...been thinking about it a bit....
I can say that the so called "personal attacks" and the complaints about NSR's and thread hijacking can probably all be applied to my posts.....at least at one time or another....
However I come here to debate, banter, learn, laugh, get frustrated, bait, etc. etc. with a group of people who share the common passion of swimming with me...I much prefer to hear the wine tastes of a swimmer along with their swimming specific questions/comments inserted into a post vs. a non-swimmer.....sorry but I'm biased....and I would be VERY bored and check out if this forum changed as some here seem to want.....
For all those that "lurK' or don't have any desire to post for whatever reason I would share with you that I was the same for sometime...but over the last few years I have made many friends here and will (until banned) continue to bloviate....if for some reason that offends people...well thats not my intent and I would encourage you to set the "ignore Paul" feature of this forum....
Geek, Gull, Fortress, Terry, Ion.....all in my opinion make up much f the heart and soul of this forum.....in spite of the occasional "tiffs".....I selfishly hope everyone is bigger than that and sticks around or comes back.....
I am alarmed that we may be moving into the area of Politically Correct for the sake of a few; those folks who are unhappy and make everyone else pay for it. Folks, please listen. The people who have occasionally gotten off topic have already said they would now be more aware of their writings, and since this topic just came up a day or so ago, why not give people a chance to try to work this out before departing?
It is important to see how the threads go for awhile, and I'll tell you this, it just doesn't bother me that people get off-track, so what? Why does it have to be YOUR way? Mixing it up to me is light-heartedness. But I get that some of you don't appreciate much of the off-discussion.
And I am saddened that some of you think that a few of the people who are not here right now are the only ones who have something worthy to say. Many here have contributed greatly, but if those who are missing are your only heroes, so be it.
Maybe the TI Forum should be checked out to see if their postings are more swimming related for some of the people here. After all, Terry is very serious about the swimming environment and the forum there may be just what some are looking for. I can't attest because I haven't been there, but all of us could be on more than one board to meet our needs; just a positive thought, that's all.
I believe this forum to be a wonderful place and hope all remain to enjoy it, but people's personalities do shine through amidst both the serious swimming inquiries/replies, as well as the friendly nature of their words whether on or off topic.
Why can't we all just wait and see how the next few weeks ago before coming to a conclusion to depart from this forum. There are actually a lot of good swimming questions/problems that have been answered to the poster's satisfaction on this board.
Donna
I agree with Donna completely. Change takes time. Give it a few weeks to catch on before jumping to a hasty conclusion or leaving for good. Patience......
However I come here to debate, banter, learn, laugh, get frustrated, bait, etc. etc. with a group of people who share the common passion of swimming with me...I much prefer to hear the wine tastes of a swimmer along with their swimming specific questions/comments inserted into a post vs. a non-swimmer.....sorry but I'm biased....and I would be VERY bored and check out if this forum changed as some here seem to want.....
Geek, Gull, Fortress, Terry, Ion.....all in my opinion make up much f the heart and soul of this forum.....in spite of the occasional "tiffs".....I selfishly hope everyone is bigger than that and sticks around or comes back.....
Great, after I am done driving around tonight (don't want to offend "He Who Offends Easily" with a drunk driving situation ala Michael Phelps), I will sit down and enjoy a nice Russian River chardonnay. Another poster advised me to have a nice pinot grigio with fish tomorrow, so I hope to oblige him shortly. I hope you actually loosen up a little, stop worrying about your waistline and beating evil smith and imbibe some tonight too. :thhbbb: :thhbbb: I don't just want to hear about SPL every waking moment. :thhbbb:
Anyone can feel free to put me on ignore as well. :groovy: Life is too short to be overly boring every single sentence. So I'll stay on topic and also zing Paul Smith. Others I am prepared to be very tolerant of whether serious or outrageous.
Great, after I am done driving around tonight (don't want to offend "He Who Offends Easily" with a drunk driving situation ala Michael Phelps), I will sit down and enjoy a nice Russian River chardonnay. Another poster advised me to have a nice pinot grigio with fish tomorrow, so I hope to oblige him shortly. I hope you actually loosen up a little, stop worrying about beating evil smith and imbibe some tonight too. :thhbbb: :thhbbb: I don't just want to hear about SPL every waking moment. :thhbbb:
Anyone can feel free to put me on ignore as well. :groovy: Life is too short to be overly boring. So I'll stay on topic and also zing Paul Smith.
You girl!
Oh....and I've decided that I'm putting all breastrokers on my ignore list! :thhbbb:
This thread is far more of a train wreck than the swim camp thread. That thread got hijacked and then went off the bantering deep end.
This thread is just a bunch of :argue: and yet more insults from the censors.
