yeah, on the link you posted, he doesn't address it for the longer races. on the link in the original post in this thread, there is a chart that shows how to structure his race pace sets based on the distance you are training for. He list's 75's and 100's as the repeat distance for the 1500.
I came quite late in this discussion, not sure this particular point's been correctly addressed later, but work duration must be short, as one of the key principle in this form of training, well, I'd say are:
- Avoiding glycogen depletion
- Avoiding severe acidosis
- Therefore relying on ATP-CP (Creatine Phosphate, sorry I wrote it in french)
So any interpretation to the effect that one could swim bouts of 75 or 100y is undoubtedly a misinterpretation, as it would violate all these principles.
As fortress mentioned (I believe) short rest is necessary to optimize contribution of aerobic metabolism, which is probably put to contribution to restore CP levels between the bouts. If this metabolism slows down too much (ie resting too much), then it's possible that the rate of CP be compromized? And for sure, the aerobic metabolism is likely steadily trained here, as half life of most physiological changes occurring at during most oxidative metabolism is about 30sec, hence why they recommend not going over this.
Therefore an extension of the ultra-short approach, for the long distance specialist could work with any given durations, however this is a different principle. Broken intervals have been there for as long as I can remember, that's just your 60x100m on 1:25 sort of stuff for the ow marathon specialist, or your 15-30x100 on 1:25 for your 1500m specialist. Same principle here, since half life of (...) as long as you keep the rest quite short, your body barely notices that you stopped.
This morning in practice I head a lane for myself and divided the 50 meter in parts of 12,5 m. The first set I managed to do 32 sprints of 12,5 with 20 sec rest.
In the second set I came to 16. I think the pitfall is to swim AFAP and when I understand Rushall correct he says that you should have the pace from a 100 m.
Makes perfect sense, although for a Fly specialist, there would be nothing wrong in making this pace that of the 200m.
I think looking at the resources, the author would say that the energy systems aren't really what you should be looking at.
It's important in reading and making our own sense out of such a text to better understand who Brent Rushall is.
His texts aren't always easy to accept among coaches, because he's been consistent over the decades in questioning how *we* (since I'm a coach) train our swimmers. And he's right I believe. As time goes by, stuff he's written a long time ago hasn't made as much sense as it does now.
For instance, he's complaining in this text that the technical component of most strokes is not developed in an optimize way. Who could state other wise? When we know that still in 2012, several high level squads (ie, for instance the varsity level where I work) do NOT offer any form of private coaching, not even targeted for their best candidates. No underwater video feedback. Coaching in 2012 resembles a lot to coaching 20y ago.
Brent Rushall is a lot dedicated to wake coaching world up.
The few key elements in this paper are:
- There's no such thing as freestyle technique. There's FS technique at sprint race pace, at mid d race pace, at distance race pace, etc
- All these techniques must be addressed
- They are often left aside (technically, it's hard to video feedback for a sprinter who's best 100 is 50sec flat, requires an extra effort trust me)
- Lactate shuffle in swimming is more of an issue (in a positive way) than in most other endurance cyclic sport
My opinion (which is worth nothing compared to Rushall's) is that they're still a need to fully train the anaerobic capacity. That said, what this paper suggests is that it should not be overdone, if one wants to avoid wasting too much sugar on that.
On a more philosophical note, I don't think US swimming world needs Rushall as much as the Canadian swimming world does. The medal count per capita is much higher south of our borders compared to here, where I must admit that coaching really sucks, even in 2012. And frankly, it's not about to change.
This morning in practice I head a lane for myself and divided the 50 meter in parts of 12,5 m. The first set I managed to do 32 sprints of 12,5 with 20 sec rest.
In the second set I came to 16. I think the pitfall is to swim AFAP and when I understand Rushall correct he says that you should have the pace from a 100 m.
I hope I can do this type of training at least once a week. I noticed a difference with the normal sprinttraining(for instance 25 meters all out with more rest) and that was that my arms stayed clear from lactic acid.
It's interesting how swim training seems as subject to fashion trends as, well, fashion.
Not too long ago, the disciples of Alexander Popov were following an approach that, it seemed to me, boiled down to this: Swim with perfect form but in relatively slow motion. No need to exert yourself!
Now, courtesy of Mr. or Dr. Rushall, a new view has emerged: swim super fast, but only for short bursts. No need to build up muscle-pain-inducing compounds (I know lactic acid is off the hook now, but not sure what the new villain is that causes swimming pain. I know something does!).
To be sure, I doubt whether Popov or Rushall intended their respective approaches to be ways to avoid, well, hurting during practice! But I think there are more than a few swimmers anxious to find something that 100 percent kiboshes the old chestnut: No pain no gain.
Popovian super easy or Rushallian super short, I can see the seduction of both. I just don't think any extreme approaches are likely to pan out as the panaceas their devotees are hoping for. Both probably have some benefits, and I am not one to advocate suffering for suffering's sake.
But some degree of significant suffering from training is likely to be inescapable for those hoping to achieve their own peak performance. To think otherwise, in this layman's opinion, is wishful thinking.
And on this note, I am off to do 12 x all out stairs climbs--one stair at a time--to my napping chamber upstairs. (I am hoping that by resting 2-3 seconds after each stair, I will be significantly less winded than when I attempt to high-speed clamber up all of them consecutively without rest.)
And likewise, I don't think Rushall is recommending the abandon of what will forever constitute the majority of any swimmer's menu, ie the relatively low level work.
Even if an elite did spend 4-5 hours booking ultra short intervals, you're still left with at last double this time doing something else.
All Rushall does, as he usually do, is reacting against what he witness, which probably is that too many swimmers spend too little time working at race pace.
I agree with what both of you guys have to say.
It's just my observation that some swimmers, human nature being what it is, are always looking for an easy alternative route to glory.
If something trendy comes along and appears to offer this, it can be easy to pay special attention to the easy-appearing part (be this Popov's famous slow motion swimming or Rushall's 7.5 yard sprints) and less attention to the rest of their recommended protocols.
Anyone who swims meets and gives all out efforts to a couple events every day for four days in a row knows how utterly exhausting this becomes. I am absolutely in favor of race pace swimmiing, and I am equally in favor of working on technique (though I agree with an earlier poster who said that sprint freestyle is a different stroke from distance freestyle, so it's hard for me to see how slow motion swimming can help ingrain sprint technique all that effectively.)
In any event, I want to be like Popov and I want to be like Rich, and I will do what I can to emulate both of my idols!
Jim,
You may be misinterpreting the way Popov trained. While he may have perfected his stroke through slow swimming, his coach, Touretski, believed in race pace training. I have a long article by him describing how Popov had to accomplish 100 race pace 100 freestyles in the year prior to the Olympics. Now, this certainly isn't Ultra Short, but is most definitely race pace.
One part of his training I've tried to copy was simulating an upcoming competition during consecutive practices about 3 weeks out. If I had 3 races on one day I'd swim those events in order in one hour. One on the top of the hour, one on 30 minutes and the last on the top. Full dress rehearsal. Fast suit, cap, cheering teammates, etc. Thus, for an upcoming 3 day nationals I'd devote 3 consecutive practice days to this protocol.
I believe that Bowman used this approach for Phelps prior to 2008 Olympics and I know Todd Schmitz did this for Missy to prepare her for her short turnarounds.
How on earth will I ever be able to come back strong on the last 25m of a 100m ***, and on the last 50m of a 200m ***, if I never go above 12.5 at race pace in training.
Rushall advocates repeats of 25 and 50 meters to train for 100 meter events and 25-75 meters for 200 meter events. 12.5s are only used to train for 50 meter events. See the chart on page 7.
And I agree with the points you made above, but I don't agree with this:
What this paper doesn't say is:
Replace all your existing mileage by UST. It just says to replace your QUALITY portion by UST
You may be right, but I don't know where he states this. I have a feeling you just can't believe he'd recommend such a radical departure from convention training, but I think he is.
Rushall advocates repeats of 25 and 50 meters to train for 100 meter events and 25-75 meters for 200 meter events. 12.5s are only used to train for 50 meter events. See the chart on page 7.
And I agree with the points you made above, but I don't agree with this:
You may be right, but I don't know where he states this. I have a feeling you just can't believe he'd recommend such a radical departure from convention training, but I think he is.
I don't view 30 x 25 as a 50 set (maybe for long course). I train for 50s soley in the CP and anaerobic systems with max rest and recovery. If you're taxing the aerobic system, you're not doing an AFAP sprint. This seems like more of a sprint conditioning set to me. I see how it could sometimes substitute for a set of AFAP 50 or 100 reps, which are extremely fatiguing. Still, I don't think it should replace broken or rehearsal swims.
I'm doing one of these sets today to replace my LP set for the week. Hate those!
