Wet suit or not for open water swimming?

I agree that the atmosphere at Open Water swims is terrific. My family loves going with me, which was not so much the case when I was racing triathlon. Not trying to be snobby about it--it's just the reality we've found. I do the St. Croix 5-mile swim whenever I can make it there, and the swimmers hang together regardless of ability and experience. The day before, most swimmers take a snorkeling trip together and I love the fact that those who are strictly middle of the pack--ie. ME--get to enjoy and spend time with, and learn from swimmers whose abilities and accomplishments far outstrip what I can comprehend. Everyone does training swims right from the hotel beach and people who'd never be in the same lane indoors swim together for the good company. We've made some great friends there and there's no sense that anyone is better than anyone else, just that we're there to see whatever wildlife we can, swim safely, and have a great time. People taking 5 hours get the same kind of cheers as those doing under 2 hours. There's no wetsuits, since you'd suffocate, but also no sense of judgment. Can't wait to get back there in October...

I have no problem with wet suits even though I don't wear one. I prefer races with a separate wet suit division, but as Leonard said, if there isn't one, tough. I know what I'm getting into. I also have found that swimmers of all abilities participate in the OWS I compete in, and I've never even been involved in an overly aggressive start. A little bumping at the beginning, but then none of us can see two feet in front of us so it happens. Certainly never seen any overly macho stuff (except from the occasional dork who loudly proclaims before the start he's only doing this to prepare for an Iron Man length tri). And even tho I swim 450 miles a year in a pool and only about 10-15 per year in the open water, I'm always welcome. I don't have a problem with triathletes doing OWS with or without wet suits regardless of their swimming ability. I DO have a problem with triathletes entering OWS events, being aggressive at the start despite a lack of ability, and generally thrashing about like brutes to the detriment of others. To those folks, I say, "Stay away from OWS. Stick to your tri's, and I will stick to my swims." (of course, if you've seen me try to run, you'd know why. . . .:cane:)

How does wearing a wetsuit constitute a moral issue? Because "real" OW swimming is (wo)man against the elements, without any aid. I think you will find the OW community to be extremely welcoming and encouraging I have been to many OW races. They are just fine and the people there are great. I like pool meets too. I just get tired of the attitude typified by t-shirts like "real swimmers swim naked," joke or not. If you think that holier-than-thou attitude isn't there, then I think you aren't paying attention. You yourself distinguished triathletes -- many of whom are very fast in the water -- from swimmers over this issue, and Leonard talks about non-wetsuit-wearers as morally superior. I understand these statements are meant to be light-hearted but they still reflect this underlying, look-down-your-nose attitude. All IMO, of course.

There are both macho/"morally superior" and very cool/down-to-earth/supportive types in practically any sport you go into. The proportions might vary from OW to triathlons, but I don't have enough data to convince me. I just ignore the former and try to hang with the latter.

The wetsuit people can wallow in their awards and the non-wetsuit people (me) can wallow in their moral superiority. A win-win. -LBJ How does wearing a wetsuit constitute a moral issue?

I thought that caps are allowed for those crossings. Swimsuit, cap and goggles only. Everyone who finishes is in a picture with a cap on.

That's one of the problems that swimming has right now, which is hampering growth and creating bad feelings. If people continue to hold these attitudes, we will shut-out the very people that we need to bring in (ie, triathletes and fitness swimmers). Take a quick look at annual memberships for a second: USA-Triathlon: >115,000 annual members (not including 1-day memberships) US Masters Swimming: ~48,000 members (not including 1-day memberships) Note: USA-T annual membership never exceeded 21,000 until after 2000... What would those numbers be if USA-T said "real athletes don't need wetsuits" and banned them from their events? Think about it for a moment... If we want to make masters swimming more attractive to new people, we should get rid of bad attitudes about wetsuits and the people who wear them. NOTE: I do not own a wetsuit and have competed in open water swims in the Atlantic Ocean without one. Growth for the sake of growth is both soulless and likely unsustainable (just ask the mortgage industry, they relaxed the rules to grow). The reality is that most open water events I participate in, have divisions that allow wetsuits, who is telling them no? Or is it that USMS is jealous that many of the major open water events are not sanctioned by USMS or USAT for that matter.. No you don't need to be a member of USMS or USAT to swim the La Jolla Roughwater swim, or many of my local openwater race series. FYI, my masters swim club has plenty of triathletes and fitness swimmers most have no need to be USMS members as they don't plan to compete in USMS sanctioned races. I agree that "growth for its own sake" is a bad idea. But I really dislike the "triathletes do, swimmers don't" attitude. It is, pardon me for saying so, incredibly snobby. I like to think of USMS as welcoming swimmers of various ability levels and confidence. Part of the issue may be that there is something of a distinction between the pool and OW swim communities, though obviously there is overlap. OW swimming is more "macho," conquering the elements and so forth. There is perhaps less interest in helping weak swimmers overcome their fears, and certainly not by using wetsuits or other floaties. There is some reason for this. A person who is a weak swimmer is always close to a wall or lane line in a pool, to hang onto and catch his/her breath. That isn't true in an OW swim, particularly an ocean swim, so it may not be a great idea to encourage marginal swimmers by allowing them to use wetsuits. People can still drown in them. I'm sure there is a psychological aspect as well; panic attacks may be more likely in cold and/or wavy water, particularly if there is a lot of jostling from other swimmers. I have always liked cable swims as a sort of intermediate step between pool swimming and "real" OW swimming. They may not always be the most interesting OW swims around (though I did really like the one I did at Lake Placid) but having the cable "lane line" there provides a sense of familiarity for someone who is a pool swimmer but OW novice.

chris, i hope to see you at lake placid again this year You yourself distinguished triathletes -- many of whom are very fast in the water -- bec and laurel make a habit of kicking my ass in the pool www.wassnertwins.com/.../home.html and just finished first and third in the columbia triathlon... congrats to themfrom swimmers over this issue, and Leonard talks about non-wetsuit-wearers as morally superior. I understand these statements are meant to be light-hearted but they still reflect this underlying, look-down-your-nose attitude. how do you think the swimming world would react to allowing noodles in distance freestyle events? hey, it might increase participation. i think you would see some real venom (as opposed to said light hearted jabs)

That's one of the problems that swimming has right now, which is hampering growth and creating bad feelings. If people continue to hold these attitudes, we will shut-out the very people that we need to bring in (ie, triathletes and fitness swimmers). Take a quick look at annual memberships for a second: USA-Triathlon: >115,000 annual members (not including 1-day memberships) US Masters Swimming: ~48,000 members (not including 1-day memberships) Note: USA-T annual membership never exceeded 21,000 until after 2000... What would those numbers be if USA-T said "real athletes don't need wetsuits" and banned them from their events? Think about it for a moment... If we want to make masters swimming more attractive to new people, we should get rid of bad attitudes about wetsuits and the people who wear them. NOTE: I do not own a wetsuit and have competed in open water swims in the Atlantic Ocean without one. Growth for the sake of growth is both soulless and likely unsustainable (just ask the mortgage industry, they relaxed the rules to grow). The reality is that most open water events I participate in, have divisions that allow wetsuits, who is telling them no? Or is it that USMS is jealous that many of the major open water events are not sanctioned by USMS or USAT for that matter.. No you don't need to be a member of USMS or USAT to swim the La Jolla Roughwater swim, or many of my local openwater race series. FYI, my masters swim club has plenty of triathletes and fitness swimmers most have no need to be USMS members as they don't plan to compete in USMS sanctioned races.

I have said it before. In OW swimming I agree that wetsuit or not , all swimmers should be welcome. Thats how a sport grows. There should be two classes wetsuit and non wetsuit. Many swim events already do this. Yes its harder to finish without a wetsuit and thus the non wetsuit swimmers can hold their heads high for that. And the wetsuit people can do the same .. how many people can swim even a mile in the general population.? Today swimmers are doing things that would have been unbeliveable to most people 40 years ago like swimming regularly back and forth from Alcatraz or across the Golden Gate or the Chesapeake Bay or Tampa bay.