Regarding the back to *** turn in the IM, is it legal to grab the wall or top of the gutter when turning? I find that grabbing the wall helps in pulling the legs into the wall in preparation for pushing off. I read the rules on the backstroke and IM and did not see anything prohibiting this, but want to make sure before developing a habit. Also, any advice on a better way of making the turn is welcomed.
YES you may but sometimes there's no wall to grab
I do a flip over turn and it's the fastest for me
I touch the wall underwater on my back then flip my legs straight over
there's no question that I touch the wall on my back
YouTube- 2010 Masters SCY Nats 200 IM Men 45 to 49 1:58.20 NR
YouTube- MICHAEL PHELPS back/*** turn
Do you guys always turn off the same arm? or do you decide at the flags?
My backstroke is not good enough to be predictable, so I have a hard time touching with my good arm every time. I can turn with the other arm, just not as fast.
Do you guys always turn off the same arm? or do you decide at the flags?
My backstroke is not good enough to be predictable, so I have a hard time touching with my good arm every time. I can turn with the other arm, just not as fast.
One nice thing about flipping straight over is that (for me at least) it doesn't matter which hand touches the wall.
Grabbing the wall is fine. As for better turn execution, I've been imitating this for the last few weeks:
YouTube- turn backstroke-breaststroke / virata dorso-rana
Grabbing the wall is fine. As for better turn execution, I've been imitating this for the last few weeks:
YouTube- turn backstroke-breaststroke / virata dorso-rana
I wouldn't recommend this turn. More often than not you will end up too far from the wall to get a decent push-off.
Not that much because of its superior efficiency over Phelps', but mainly because I certainly don't trust our officials here. Phelps' version implies to reach an almost perfect vertical position whilst touching the wall.
I don't think our officials are ready to issue a fair judgment over this. Or at least, I would try it during non important races first too inquire about their education level.
This is an excellent point. I feel like I've got good command of the flip-over turn, enough so that I'm going to try it in competition, but in the back of my mind I've been wondering if I'm going to find myself arguing with an official after each IM race. I think it was Jeff Commings who mentioned a while back that he has successfully appealed some DQ's. I need to brush up on the rule book so I understand what's involved in appealing a DQ, in case I ever need to.
YES you may but sometimes there's no wall to grab
I'm with Ande here. If you're at a meet with the FINA pads that extend out of the water you will not be able to grab the wall. It's better to just learn to do the turn without grabbing.
Here's the relevant bits from www.usms.org/.../part1.pdf:
Backstroke to breaststroke—The swimmer must touch the wall while on the back. Once a legal touch has been made, the swimmer may turn in any manner, but the shoulders must be at or past the vertical toward the *** when the swimmer leaves the wall and the prescribed breaststroke form must be attained prior to the first arm stroke.
102.16.1 The official results of any protested race shall not be announced, the affected awards shall not be given and points scored shall not be allocated until the protest is resolved or is withdrawn in writing.
102.16.2 Protests affecting the eligibility of any swimmer to compete or to represent an organization in any race shall be made in writing to the meet director or referee before the race is held, and if the meet committee deems it advisable, the swimmer may compete under protest and it shall be so announced before the race. The meet committee shall immediately refer such protest to the LMSC officers (local meets) or championship meet protest committee (national championship meets; see article 104.5.9B) having jurisdiction for adjudication at the earliest possible time.
102.16.3 Protests against judgment decisions of starters and stroke, turn and relay takeoff judges can only be considered by the referee, and the referee’s decision shall be final.
102.16.4 Protests concerning interpretation of the rules in Part 1: Swimming Rules and the Glossary shall be submitted in writing (on paper or in an electronic file), within 10 days to the USMS Rules Committee chair, who shall issue a decision in writing (on paper or in an electronic file) within five days of the date of receipt of such protest, unless the USMS Rules Committee chair notifies the parties that the issue must come before the entire committee.
The ruling shall be final and binding on all parties.
102.16.5 Any other protest arising from the competition itself shall be made within 30 minutes after the race in which the alleged infraction took place. If the protest is not resolved immediately, the protester shall at that time file a written protest with the chair of the LMSC or the chair’s representative having jurisdiction over the event. If the LMSC does not satisfactorily resolve the protest within 10 days, the protester may appeal in writing to the USMS Rules Committee chair within the next five days for final adjudication, whose decision shall then be binding on all parties.
Among the two clips provided by Ande, the flip turn has to be my first pick.
Not that much because of its superior efficiency over Phelps', but mainly because I certainly don't trust our officials here. Phelps' version implies to reach an almost perfect vertical position whilst touching the wall.
I don't think our officials are ready to issue a fair judgment over this. Or at least, I would try it during non important races first too inquire about their education level.
Tried it in the pool today - what a mess I was! All twisted to the side! Guess I need to work on it more.
If I try the Shanteau/Mania style turn, I usually end up like that too. The flip-over turn has no twisting at all, so I can do it pretty consistently.
