Butterfly timing

I have seen many swimmers with similar strokes patterns, mostly swimmers who didn't swim in their youth and learned butterfly as adults. With the swimmers in my club that I have tried to work with there seem to be a couple obstacles to correcting it. One is that they want a glide/rest in their stroke, either because they aspire to swim longer events or complete tougher sets than their combination of fitness and technique allow them to complete without a rest/glide phase, or because they seem to serialize stroke components that should occur in parallel, i.e. "kick, kick, pull" instead of the pulls and kicks happening concurrently. I think Bill's no-kick 25s might be a good approach, or possibly just one kick, for the couple guys I've got that can't seem to get away from the two kicks before the catch timing. I'll try that with them. I also find that a lot of these swimmers do a big out and in scull at the front of the stroke, I imagine this has its origins in the "keyhole" pull pattern, but it gets exaggerated into almost tracing the outline of a capital T, i.e. straight out and straight back in and then back. Alfonso does this. Allen, having looked at Phelp's stroke I understand the idea of a wide entry with the chest descending and the hands remaining near the surface, but no one I know personally has the shoulder flexibility to do that, I certainly don't. I think you're right that Alfonso would benefit from eliminating the down and up and most of the out and in with his hands and just catch and pull. This changes the timing of the stroke so much that a lot of swimmers struggle with it and often end up rejecting this change as it feels all wrong to them compared to what they are used to. I'm still working on this myself. I will try Bill's full stop drill next time I'm in the pool, I can't entirely visualize it at the moment. Solar, yes that's the Alfonso and Simon from ACC, and yes I'm based out of Moncton but visit Montreal a few times a year. Simon has a 2:18.94 SCM 200 and a 1:01.50 SCM 100 so I figured he must be doing something right! I am sure he was loafing it in the video so that may have affected his stroke. Solar, if you were Alfonso's coach what approach would you take? Thanks for your suggestions Bill and Allen, more comments welcome!

I have seen many swimmers with similar strokes patterns, mostly swimmers who didn't swim in their youth and learned butterfly as adults. With the swimmers in my club that I have tried to work with there seem to be a couple obstacles to correcting it. One is that they want a glide/rest in their stroke, either because they aspire to swim longer events or complete tougher sets than their combination of fitness and technique allow them to complete without a rest/glide phase, or because they seem to serialize stroke components that should occur in parallel, i.e. "kick, kick, pull" instead of the pulls and kicks happening concurrently. I think Bill's no-kick 25s might be a good approach, or possibly just one kick, for the couple guys I've got that can't seem to get away from the two kicks before the catch timing. I'll try that with them. I also find that a lot of these swimmers do a big out and in scull at the front of the stroke, I imagine this has its origins in the "keyhole" pull pattern, but it gets exaggerated into almost tracing the outline of a capital T, i.e. straight out and straight back in and then back. Alfonso does this. Allen, having looked at Phelp's stroke I understand the idea of a wide entry with the chest descending and the hands remaining near the surface, but no one I know personally has the shoulder flexibility to do that, I certainly don't. I think you're right that Alfonso would benefit from eliminating the down and up and most of the out and in with his hands and just catch and pull. This changes the timing of the stroke so much that a lot of swimmers struggle with it and often end up rejecting this change as it feels all wrong to them compared to what they are used to. I'm still working on this myself. I will try Bill's full stop drill next time I'm in the pool, I can't entirely visualize it at the moment. Solar, yes that's the Alfonso and Simon from ACC, and yes I'm based out of Moncton but visit Montreal a few times a year. Simon has a 2:18.94 SCM 200 and a 1:01.50 SCM 100 so I figured he must be doing something right! I am sure he was loafing it in the video so that may have affected his stroke. Solar, if you were Alfonso's coach what approach would you take? Thanks for your suggestions Bill and Allen, more comments welcome!