The following has appeared on a swim forum in the UK
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I’ve been looking at recent masters results. It’s clear that swimmers are producing much slower times without bodysuits. Furthermore, many swimmers are disillusioned and are on the verge of giving up completely. It would be a travesty if these swimmers (they are mostly the over 45s) were lost to the sport altogether.
The majority of masters swimmers prefer to compete in bodysuits. Of that there is no doubt, as witnessed at masters meets up and down the country. It is a disgrace that masters swimmers have been included in the ‘new rules’ concerning elite swimming. I find it quite sad that many swimmers are talking about cutting up their suits, taking out zips and even asking whether they are allowed ‘modesty panels’ in their suits any more.
As always, we are getting no advice, guidance or even leadership from the toothless Masters Committee, whose gingivitic and malocclusive tendencies are attracting Big Nev’s interest, but that’s to be expected.
But it doesn’t have to be like this. Masters swimmers in Italy are not accepting this farce. They are still holding meets where swimmers can choose to wear bodysuits.
There was a recent questionnaire sent out to 4,000 masters swimmers in France. 2,700 swimmers replied, stating they wished to keep their bodysuits for competition.
Masters swimmers in Germany are on the verge of revolution! They accept that masters swimmers are not going to be a threat to any Olympian’s records. Many have now entered masters meets in Italy where they can wear their suits if they want. Also, some meet organisers in Germany are holding similar meets.
Instead of following any directive from our anaemic and tedious Masters Committee, I’d like to see masters swimmers in the UK make a stand against the stupidity surrounding the banning of bodysuits. It will cost me time and money but I’m prepared to organise this.
We need meet organisers in the UK to hold ‘optional suit’ masters meets. Swimmers can choose whether to wear a suit or not. If they are going for a record then the suitless option is a must - but only for a while. I believe that if we boycott masters meets where suits are now allowed, meet organisers, the Masters Committee and the ASA would have to take notice. At the moment they don’t give a toss. At the forefront of the ASA’s mind would be the loss of revenue. Believe me, they see masters swimming as a joke anyway, they would happily let masters swim in bodysuits if it meant they could keep the revenue pouring in.
Getting meet organisers to run ‘bodysuit’ meets would be easy. They would be oversubscribed, every time. Not only from our swimmers but from overseas entries too. I can see one-day meets turning into weekend ones. The organisers could make a lot of money from these well-attended meets. Pulling the plug on masters meets because of low entries would be a thing of the past.
These meets would be the thin end of the wedge in bringing about a change of rules. It‘s the boycotting of ‘non-suit’ meets that would bring a change of rule overnight.
The decathlon would be meaningless because ‘suited’ swims wouldn’t count towards it - but in reality, it is a meaningless competition anyway for all but ten swimmers in the UK who have a chance of winning it.
Don’t underestimate what can be done. Masters swimmers are a powerful group in swimming. The Government is putting very large amounts of money into the greasy hand of the ASA to promote health and fitness for adults. The ASA wouldn’t like the kind of publicity we can give them.
If you feel you can support this initiative I’ll make a start. Masters swimmers in Italy, France and Germany are ready to come on board. Many masters swimmers in America are also willing to make a stand against their governing body. Naturally, support from suit manufacturers is there already. I’ve spoken to four of the biggest.
My friends and I coined this term.
For example, you swim in what you think is a sanctioned USMS meet.
Your times may or may not be entered into the "Event Rankings." If the times are entered into Event Rankings, say, for example, you are listed as #2 in your age group in a particular event. Prelim Top 10 comes out and all of a sudden your swim and all the swims from the meet are not listed. You are not notified of this fact (other than you see the missing swims) nor are you told why the swims disappeared. It's as if you never did the swim and the meet never existed. In essence, you are disqualified months after the meet taking place and you are disqualified from Top10 without being told how or why.
Now, if you want to take the initiative, you can pester people about the missing meet and you may be given a reason as to why the meet ended up not counting.
I always thought it would be very useful to see data as it pertains to the percentage of meets that end up not counting for Top 10.
Based on what I hear, I think the number is small and you've been unlucky.
Responding to both your and Fort's disparagement of the Dixie Zone...I have swum in (by my count) 4 meets in NC in the last few years, all of which were submitted to both the Meet Results database and to TT. No problems there. I also had no problems when I lived in Florida, though that was quite some time ago. In fact I can still find some of my old times from that era.
Sanctioning is done at the LMSC level, so I can only tell you what happens in Virginia. But when a meet is sanctioned the meet director agrees to take care of pool measurements and to submit the results on the TT recorder in a timely manner in electronic form. Failure to do these things can result in not being granted a sanction in the future. Measurements are not an issue so much here b/c all our main meets are in pools with walls (not bulkheads) so they don't need to be remeasured for each meet.
I asked Mary Beth Windrath about meets that are submitted after the deadline. Here was her response:
"Normally adding swims, especially an entire meet, is not done. If a TT recorder realizes they accidentally omitted a meet, I usually take it, but that is only because we try to support our TT recorders. In the case that the meet director did not send the meet results to the TT person, then we do not accept it. Or if the top ten person submits late, we do not accept it, regardless of how many meets were involved. Just to clarify, as long as the top ten person has made an attempt to submit by the deadline, even if there is some issue with it such as a bad format, then I accept it. That mostly happens with new recorders who are figuring things out. In the case where we have an accidentally missed meet and we do accept it, I usually ask the TT person to just give me the swims that make top ten, rather than the entire meet. When a swimmer emails one of us and says, my results didn't show up, I find out why. Usually it is one of the two cases I mentioned and we go from there."
Mary Beth is not obligated to accept new swims after the deadline but she will sometimes go out of her way to do so. When I first started out as a TT recorder, I didn't realize until after the deadline that we were responsible for submitting times from our swimmers in foreign meets. I quickly pored over the meet, compared it to the preliminary TT, and pulled those times that would make the list and submitted them. Since I was new and had done most of her work for her, she took pity on me and accepted them. She often does the same for others, but her job requires a LOT of time and we shouldn't abuse her kindness. Hence the need for strict deadlines.
My friends and I coined this term.
For example, you swim in what you think is a sanctioned USMS meet.
Your times may or may not be entered into the "Event Rankings." If the times are entered into Event Rankings, say, for example, you are listed as #2 in your age group in a particular event. Prelim Top 10 comes out and all of a sudden your swim and all the swims from the meet are not listed. You are not notified of this fact (other than you see the missing swims) nor are you told why the swims disappeared. It's as if you never did the swim and the meet never existed. In essence, you are disqualified months after the meet taking place and you are disqualified from Top10 without being told how or why.
Now, if you want to take the initiative, you can pester people about the missing meet and you may be given a reason as to why the meet ended up not counting.
I always thought it would be very useful to see data as it pertains to the percentage of meets that end up not counting for Top 10.
Based on what I hear, I think the number is small and you've been unlucky.
Responding to both your and Fort's disparagement of the Dixie Zone...I have swum in (by my count) 4 meets in NC in the last few years, all of which were submitted to both the Meet Results database and to TT. No problems there. I also had no problems when I lived in Florida, though that was quite some time ago. In fact I can still find some of my old times from that era.
Sanctioning is done at the LMSC level, so I can only tell you what happens in Virginia. But when a meet is sanctioned the meet director agrees to take care of pool measurements and to submit the results on the TT recorder in a timely manner in electronic form. Failure to do these things can result in not being granted a sanction in the future. Measurements are not an issue so much here b/c all our main meets are in pools with walls (not bulkheads) so they don't need to be remeasured for each meet.
I asked Mary Beth Windrath about meets that are submitted after the deadline. Here was her response:
"Normally adding swims, especially an entire meet, is not done. If a TT recorder realizes they accidentally omitted a meet, I usually take it, but that is only because we try to support our TT recorders. In the case that the meet director did not send the meet results to the TT person, then we do not accept it. Or if the top ten person submits late, we do not accept it, regardless of how many meets were involved. Just to clarify, as long as the top ten person has made an attempt to submit by the deadline, even if there is some issue with it such as a bad format, then I accept it. That mostly happens with new recorders who are figuring things out. In the case where we have an accidentally missed meet and we do accept it, I usually ask the TT person to just give me the swims that make top ten, rather than the entire meet. When a swimmer emails one of us and says, my results didn't show up, I find out why. Usually it is one of the two cases I mentioned and we go from there."
Mary Beth is not obligated to accept new swims after the deadline but she will sometimes go out of her way to do so. When I first started out as a TT recorder, I didn't realize until after the deadline that we were responsible for submitting times from our swimmers in foreign meets. I quickly pored over the meet, compared it to the preliminary TT, and pulled those times that would make the list and submitted them. Since I was new and had done most of her work for her, she took pity on me and accepted them. She often does the same for others, but her job requires a LOT of time and we shouldn't abuse her kindness. Hence the need for strict deadlines.
