Here is a question for the lawyers out there.
Do FINA regulations supersede US federal anti-sex discrimination laws?
Granted, I am not sure I know what the latter are. However, if I were to show up at a USMS swimming meet, wearing a perfectly legal women's swimming suit, one of the zipper-free kneeskin type models that also covered my ample boobage, and the officials rightly disqualified me for wearing this get-up because it is against the FINA/USMS agreed upon New Order, could I then turn around and sue under some federal statute prohibiting discrimination because gender?
In my mind, the new FINA rules are going to end up making swimming even more of a dying sport for boys in the US than the unintended consequences of Title IX, etc. Girls, especially in the younger age groups, can often beat boys in swimming, and in fact our own Mr. Qbrain got a top 10 time in the men's 30-34 LCM 1500 this summer. His wife, if I am remembering correctly, beat his time but failed to make the top 10 in the women's category.
If anything, it is we men who are now at a disadvantage. I say make the dystaff gender wear thongs and let us wear body suits fashioned to look like very streamlined tuxedos.
Suits for women now remain pretty much unchanged by the new FINA ruling, with the exception, that is, of getting rid of zippers and getting rid of non textiles. But that means women can continue to swim in what are still arguably very fast suits--FS1's, for example, that are very close to the short john types that helped loads of people get their best times. Men are prohibited from wearing anything but jammers.
Chicks, in other words, get 2004 technology; guys are back to the 60s. Why not let us go back to the 20s instead, when Johnny Weismuller wore a full body suit, albeit of wool?
So, in the spirit of Larry David, who recently concluded an episode of Curb Your Enthusiasm with the line, "I'm Larry David, and I am comfortable in women's underwear"--I propose that any men who want to join me in the latest civil rights battle of our time show up at nationals this summer in women's suits and accompanied by our class action lawyer, and join me in echoing in a collective voice that rings out in natatoriums all across the fruited plain:
"I am a male USMS swimmer, and I am comfortable wearing women's suits."
Provided I can find an esquire who will agree to take the case on a contingency basis, I say this to the USMS sexist powers that be:
See you in court! Suckers!
That's where I was raised, during the era when the textile industry was dying. I do not have fond memories. But I still have friends there and visit for the occasional poker game. It's only about half an hour away.
Yes, that was my team. After it disbanded, I quit swimming and went to work. My mother was opposed b/c swimming was going to be my ticket to college, but I knew it wasn't feasible to join a team all the way up in Atlanta and travel up there every day.
I still think it was the right decision b/c with my wages I was able to buy a car and pay for gas and insurance, which otherwise I wouldn't have been able to do (and my mom certainly couldn't have done for me).
But I hit the books and managed to get academic scholarships. All of us boys managed it one way or another, with work, scholarships, loans, and grants. Ended up with 2 lawyers and a writer.
Coach Vince wanted to take me with him to Florida when the team broke up, and let me get tutored at the university and train intensely, but my mother refused, and I doubt I would have enjoyed it. Sometimes you wonder what could have been, but life is full of choices.
I think I've just found Coach Winters' address in Orlando, and I'm going to send him a letter and a Christmas card.
I've only returned to the pool just this year, and I hope to get back into shape and see some of y'all at competitions in a couple of years. I don't have a coach, so it's slow going. And the pool I'm at has no blocks and doesn't allow diving, and is only 25yd. So we'll see.
Wow! What a small world! You must come to the Auburn meet in mid-February in the next couple of years so that we can exchange Griffin stories. Did you know that they are hosting 2011 LC Nationals?
Don't know if you know Bob Bugg, but he still lives in Griffin. He is a USMS record holder in the 50-54 age-group. He trains with some team nearby. I think he swam for the Tallman Pools team as well. He might be able to steer you to a local masters coach.
Where are you training right now?
On the suit issue, I wish they would leave things alone until the end of the SCY season. Once the season ends, I think we should have the same suit rules as USA. Perhaps two top ten tabulations should be done for the 2009 to 2010 SCY season. One for 2009 when the suit was still legal and one for 2010 when the suit is no longer legal. Of course, I guess we won't know about the suits until a couple of months into 2010. Whatever the case, the top ten tabulation should end with the deadline and a new one should start with the new rules.
For those males that want to wear a woman's suit, perhaps they should be allowed to race, but not have their time or place count. This is what is done in triathlon competitions when the water temp is over 78. You can wear a wetsuit, but your time does not count. Of course, I don't know who would want to compete if their time didn't count, but there might be some who do.
I've only returned to the pool just this year, and I hope to get back into shape and see some of y'all at competitions in a couple of years. I don't have a coach, so it's slow going. And the pool I'm at has no blocks and doesn't allow diving, and is only 25yd. So we'll see. Feel free to come join our club at Kedron in PTC:bliss:
You must not be too far from Griffin, Georgia.
That's where I was raised, during the era when the textile industry was dying. I do not have fond memories. But I still have friends there and visit for the occasional poker game. It's only about half an hour away.
Was the team that you competed for connected to Tallman Pools?
Yes, that was my team. After it disbanded, I quit swimming and went to work. My mother was opposed b/c swimming was going to be my ticket to college, but I knew it wasn't feasible to join a team all the way up in Atlanta and travel up there every day.
I still think it was the right decision b/c with my wages I was able to buy a car and pay for gas and insurance, which otherwise I wouldn't have been able to do (and my mom certainly couldn't have done for me).
But I hit the books and managed to get academic scholarships. All of us boys managed it one way or another, with work, scholarships, loans, and grants. Ended up with 2 lawyers and a writer.
Coach Vince wanted to take me with him to Florida when the team broke up, and let me get tutored at the university and train intensely, but my mother refused, and I doubt I would have enjoyed it. Sometimes you wonder what could have been, but life is full of choices.
I think I've just found Coach Winters' address in Orlando, and I'm going to send him a letter and a Christmas card.
I've only returned to the pool just this year, and I hope to get back into shape and see some of y'all at competitions in a couple of years. I don't have a coach, so it's slow going. And the pool I'm at has no blocks and doesn't allow diving, and is only 25yd. So we'll see.
My cousins still live on the land in what is known as the Birdie community (pretty close to Sunny Side and Hampton).
Oh, yes. My first girlfriend was from there. She now lives over in the town where Woody smashed up the SUV.
I truly do apologize for my earlier slight of your zone of the country, Mr. Sharpsburger. My beloved twin brother John is a Phi Beta Kappa graduate of UNC Chapel Hill, where he invented the sport of John Ball that was played in the elevator banks of Granville Towers for about 36 hours by the members of the UNC Tarheels basketball team during the George Karl Mitch Kupchak playing era.
The authorities shut the sport down when too much damage was racked up.
Anyhow, my great grandmother was from Memphis, and we have a portrait of her hanging in our dining room, a prominent bayonet mark where some yankee *** tried to spear the poor woman.
I hate us yankees with a vengeance for what they did to great granny's portrait!
For what it's worth, I should add that I didn't realize you were from the South. I actually thought you were a Harvard trained lawyer with offices in Boston, New York, Paris, and Papua, New Guinea.
We also have one other thing in common. I was a zombie extra in George Romaro's classic film, Dawn of the Dead, which was filmed in the 70s in the Monroeville Mall.
Well, kewl!
And btw, I'm not the lawyer. Both my brothers are lawyers, so I run legal questions by them. My response is by proxy.
I got accepted to law school, but changed my mind at the last minute. Two attorneys in the family was enough. :D
We also have one other thing in common. I was a zombie extra in George Romaro's classic film, Dawn of the Dead, which was filmed in the 70s in the Monroeville Mall.
!
Were you really!!!!!????? :bouncing:
Chris Stevenson has just validated my long held theory that there are actually three genders in the human race.
Ubermenchen alpha males like Chris. (1-3 percent of men)
All females. (100 percent of women)
Loser guys like me. (97-99 percent of men).
Jim, you can help your cause in two quick and easy ways:
-- get a better avatar. Now, nothing against Woodstock, but how can you resist my puppy? He is cute but still a very "bad boy," and all of that gets communicated somehow in this one shot. It gets even better when you reveal that you saved him from the animal shelter. Corny? Absolutely, but still effective.
-- stop agitating to wear women's bathing suits and skirts. I would have thought this a no-brainer, but apparently not... :)
Jim, you can help your cause in two quick and easy ways:
-- get a better avatar. Now, nothing against Woodstock, but how can you resist my puppy? He is cute but still a very "bad boy," and all of that gets communicated somehow in this one shot. It gets even better when you reveal that you saved him from the animal shelter. Corny? Absolutely, but still effective.
-- stop agitating to wear women's bathing suits and skirts. I would have thought this a no-brainer, but apparently not... :)
Chris is indeed using a tried and true method that works on most women. Alas, not me! Hahahaha. Those with severe dog allergies merely look at that avatar and break out in hives. This makes it much easier to disagree with him. :angel:
I am forced to agree that you should stop referring to them as "women's suits," and just use the former men's short john appellation when advocating for their return/approval.
Gull, thanks. :) I guess you must like sweaty unshowered women. lol
Here is a question for the lawyers out there.
Do FINA regulations supersede US federal anti-sex discrimination laws?
Granted, I am not sure I know what the latter are. However, if I were to show up at a USMS swimming meet, wearing a perfectly legal women's swimming suit, one of the zipper-free kneeskin type models that also covered my ample boobage, and the officials rightly disqualified me for wearing this get-up because it is against the FINA/USMS agreed upon New Order, could I then turn around and sue under some federal statute prohibiting discrimination because gender?
Suckers!
What's with the FINA again? Who cares what it says? Wear the suit you want. Start your own authority: Winna (or possibly Whinah). Give yourself a shorter lane, legal in Riemann space. Build your own sandbox.
:)
The FINA apprved women's suits are the female equivalent of the Jammers. If we get rid of the women's short john, then the guys have to go back to briefs only. Can we move on from any more discussion of suits?
