Training for the 1500/1650: Suggestions?

Nice time, I wish I could do that ! Thanks. Back in 2003 it did not seem possible.

In my opinion, you need to establish practice sets that are challenging to you AND maintain your interest day to day - week to week-month to month etc., including some that you will use as Test Sets. The reliable Test Set that I utilize is swimming 2000 yards and determining my average pace per hundred . This gives me a solid baseline from which to measure my improvement. Here are just a few sets I will do to train for the 1500 and Open Water Swims up to 6 miles: 1) 11-10-9-8-7-6-5-4-3-2-1 (subract 1:40 from overal time - this = 10 seconds rest per repeat). Goal is to maintain your goal pace depending where you are at for the season. 2) 30x100 maintain constant goal time and interval (resting no less than 5 seconds and no more than 10 -interval established before beginning set) Hold pace - Can descend the last 5 100's. 3) 5x25/5 + 2x50/5 + 100 + 200 + 300 + 300 + 200 + 100 + 2x50/5 + 5x25/5 (choose rest of 5 OR 10, starting after the first 100 ) 4) 3x500/60 goal to hold race pace + sprint 100/5 plus sprint 2x25/5. 5) This could be a "Mix-Up Set" such as Pull,K,Fins etc. I chose to do this all kicking with long fins: 1650 holding set pace (get time)/ then 3x500 resting 20 seconds between each 500 + 100/10 + 50 (Get total time). Goal is to hold a set pace faster than the earlier 1650. For me I will do this again to obtain improvement. It was great for leg fatigue and mental concentration. 6) Did this once. Swam for 2 hours in pool hitting established pace. I did "touch and go" open turns at 100's to catch time. However, as a twist, I flipped just a little early every turn so that I did not use wall for push off and had to use legs efficiently to re-establish body position while maintaining pace. The Best Regina

In my opinion, you need to establish practice sets that are challenging to you AND maintain your interest day to day - week to week-month to month etc., including some that you will use as Test Sets. The reliable Test Set that I utilize is swimming 2000 yards and determining my average pace per hundred . This gives me a solid baseline from which to measure my improvement. Here are just a few sets I will do to train for the 1500 and Open Water Swims up to 6 miles: 1) 11-10-9-8-7-6-5-4-3-2-1 (subract 1:40 from overal time - this = 10 seconds rest per repeat). Goal is to maintain your goal pace depending where you are at for the season. 2) 30x100 maintain constant goal time and interval (resting no less than 5 seconds and no more than 10 -interval established before beginning set) Hold pace - Can descend the last 5 100's. 3) 5x25/5 + 2x50/5 + 100 + 200 + 300 + 300 + 200 + 100 + 2x50/5 + 5x25/5 (choose rest of 5 OR 10, starting after the first 100 ) 4) 3x500/60 goal to hold race pace + sprint 100/5 plus sprint 2x25/5. 5) This could be a "Mix-Up Set" such as Pull,K,Fins etc. I chose to do this all kicking with long fins: 1650 holding set pace (get time)/ then 3x500 resting 20 seconds between each 500 + 100/10 + 50 (Get total time). Goal is to hold a set pace faster than the earlier 1650. For me I will do this again to obtain improvement. It was great for leg fatigue and mental concentration. 6) Did this once. Swam for 2 hours in pool hitting established pace. I did "touch and go" open turns at 100's to catch time. However, as a twist, I flipped just a little early every turn so that I did not use wall for push off and had to use legs efficiently to re-establish body position while maintaining pace. The Best Regina

Hi gull! Congratulations on a great mile! How long did it take for your impingement to go away after you started bi-lateral breathing? Did you do anything else to treat the problem? thanks, Impinged in Indiana It requires constant maintenance. Here is what I did beginning in 2003: 1. Saw a PT and did RC exercises (which I still do regularly). Without my PT I would not be swimming. 2. Used ice and anti-inflammatories (Vioxx was amazing). 3. Modified my workouts, avoiding paddles (which I now use) and fly (which I am swimming again). Started to see improvement after six months. I switched to bilateral breathing later (2005?), but it took quite awhile to feel natural.

19:55.13 Swam the 1650 today at, approprately enough, the First Colony Masters "There's a First Time For Everything" meet in Houston. Good job, Gull. :chug: Now that you've popped the 20 minute mark, there'll be a bunch more to follow.

Great swim! I'm planning to do my first 1650 in less than 2 months and wish I had seen this thread in October. Vioxx was a great pain reliever. Many people still get teary eyed when they think of it. Tendonitis is, as I understand, typically chronic inflammation. There is a difference in how chronic vs. acute is driven, and I'd agree that relying on NSAIDs is not a long term proposition. Injections will work for some because the high steroid dose will quash whatever inflammation is there, provided there is sufficient rest in the short term and accompanying work on the biomechanics in the long term.

I am well aware of the concept of tendinosis and the rationale for not treating inflammation. I tried that for awhile and continued to experience pain. I discussed this with my orthopedist who shared my view that pain = inflammation and recommended anti-inflammatory treatment along with PT. Interestingly, while I was taking Vioxx my migraines completely disappeared. They recurred when I stopped. It was later learned that the drug was very good at migraine prophylaxis. Interesting points. There is no question that shoulder problems are painful, but the link to inflammation seems suspect. I attended the ACSM conference in Indianapolis a couple years ago and there was a presentation on the evidence for treating these kinds of injuries with NSAIDS. If I remember correctly, one of the presenters said that there is no evidence for inflammation in many of these persistent problems (swimmers shoulder, achilles "tendinitis", tennis elbow, and other select areas where the blood supply is not all that great to begin with.) Animal studies seemed to show that NSAIDS could retard healing rates for some injuries, particularly fractures. There was some talk about how Tylenol works as well as NSAIDS in blinded studies for pain control, but without the possibility of weakening tissues. One of the other areas of investigation--and I am not sure if this panned out or not--was to use nitroglycerine patches to promote blood circulation to poorly vascularized areas like the elbow. The use of eccentric exercise here to promote inflammation and expedite healing was also discussed. As far as migraines go, I used to be a regular sufferer of these, but their frequency has definitely decreased over the years. One headache doc from Chicago I interviewed for a story once told me that this is not uncommon. With age, he said, virtually everyone undergoes some hardening of the arteries, and as the arteries in the brain lose some of their elasticity, their ability to spasm and trigger migraines similarly decreases. Who would have thought there might be a silver lining to atherosclerosis of the carotids? In any event, I wrote about my last (knock on wood) migraine for my vlog. As a fellow sufferer, you might find interesting a strategy I developed for myself while in the throes of migraine suffering: forums.usms.org/blog.php Good luck with your shoulders, and again, great time on the 1650!

Absolutely agree, Dr. Jaeger. I believe that in my case Vioxx treated the recurrent bouts of acute inflammation, but the longterm solution was PT and attention to stroke mechanics.

Ditto congratulations on an excellent 1650. In terms of item #2 on your list, what do you--as a cardiologist--think about the following: Vioxx's link to heart problems (knowingly suppressed for four years) that damaged Merck's once admirable reputation the idea that plain old generic ibuprofen and naprosen are Cox-2 Inhibitors, though not selectively so--why would Vioxx be any better? Just an individual response on your part? the idea that shoulder overuse problems (including rotator cuff "impingement" problems) are increasingly viewed by orthopedic researchers as tendonosis rather than tendinitis, and that kiboshing inflammation is exactly the opposite of what you want to do that most of these problems, unless there is traumatic damage (SLAP lesion, rotator cuff tear, and so forth) are self-limited, and that you might have healed over time without VIOXX, perhaps even faster and that the RC exercises (and ice) may have been the most valuable elements here by 1. tightening an overly lax capsule, keeping the humeral head stabilized, and 2. providing some pain relief and increased blood flow? The reason I ask is that it seems to me there really has been a sea change in how swimmers shoulder is being viewed--and yesteryear's idea of attacking inflammation (via NSAIDS or cortisone injections) is more and more emerging as counterproductive (there is no evidence of inflammation, for one thing) and injurious (retarded healing rates and, with cortisone injections especially, evidence of weakened connective tissues.) Excellent points. Vioxx and related drugs are selective Cox-2 inhibitors, unlike Ibuprofen which is nonselective, inhibiting both Cox-2 and Cox-1. I personally found it to be the most effective of the Cox-2 inhibitors and far more effective than any of the other nonsteroidal anti-inflammatory agents. Every drug has potential side effects, including aspirin, which in a large study from Harvard actually increased the risk of intracranial hemorrhage in healthy physicians. Selective Cox-2 inhibition does come at a price which for some reason was not anticipated. Inhibition of Cox-2 without Cox-1 inhibition increased the risk of thrombosis in patients with coronary artery disease; whether a daily aspirin is sufficient to negate this effect is unclear to me. Other Cox-2 inhibitors, like Celebrex, remain on the market but should be used with caution by individuals with CAD. I am well aware of the concept of tendinosis and the rationale for not treating inflammation. I tried that for awhile and continued to experience pain. I discussed this with my orthopedist who shared my view that pain = inflammation and recommended anti-inflammatory treatment along with PT. Interestingly, while I was taking Vioxx my migraines completely disappeared. They recurred when I stopped. It was later learned that the drug was very good at migraine prophylaxis.