I always thought it would be cool to be able to break 5:00 in the 500. While it would be a bit of a stretch I feel like it's potentially within reach and given enough of the right kind of training I could do it. That said I also feel like every second between me and the 5 minute mark is going to get harder and harder to knock off.
I've always been, and continue to be, more of a breaststroker than a freestyler. I have no ankle flexibility so I pretty much always need to deal with dragging two brakes through the water. I've never really trained seriously for free events even though I do try hard and consider the longer frees to be my secondary events.
To give you an idea I swim about 3000-4000 a day, probably realistically average 4-5 times a week. I can and will increase that over the winter as we head into the meets starting in January. Intervals average in the 1:15-1:20 range, sometimes dipping to 1:10. I can pretty comfortably hold 1:10-1:15 pace depending on the set. Doing a 1:00 100 from a push is hard but not impossible.
So far my fastest masters times in the 200 are 1:55 and the 500 a 5:18. I know I can go much faster in both, in that 200 I took water instead of air on the turn at the 100 and was choking and coughing for the last 100 and still somehow managed a best time. The 500 was the last event of a long weekend of swimming and I was exhausted. I bet I could have done a 1:53 and a 5:14 given better circumstances.
Anyway, any training tips or things to work on? Ideal way to split it? Is the 5:00 500 going to be ridiculously difficult or given enough training reachable?
Thanks guys. That and the :50 100 (I'll save that one for later) are two swimming marks I always wanted to check off my list.
I always thought it would be cool to be able to break 5:00 in the 500 ...
Anyway, any training tips or things to work on? Ideal way to split it? Is the 5:00 500 going to be ridiculously difficult or given enough training reachable?
Justin, it is a cool goal and you should be able to do it from where you are. I'm sure you'll get inundated with better advice, but here are some initial thoughts:
Splitting: Take a look at results of recent nationals as you'll see a number of people under 5 minutes, but also a number of ways to get there. In my experience, you always want to feel like you are negative splitting the race. In reality, you often don't, but gunning it too hard on the 1st 150 to 200 can be a real killer to keeping up the pace. It's always a very conscious effort on my part to feel like I'm cruising through the 250 mark. The 'moment of truth,' though where you need to learn to swim through the pain is from 300 to 450 yards. I find I can always get excited about picking up the pace after the halfway point and I generally have something left in the tank in the last 50, but if I don't really bear down -- and really train to do this -- during the 300 to 450 mark, I fall off the pace very quickly.
Technique: If you look at the elite swimmers, they are motoring the 500 with a 6 beat kick the whole way. You probably don't need that to get under 5 minutes if you can have an efficient, powerful 2 beat that is well-connected with your pull & core rotation. However, if you can build a stronger kick, that will come in real handy during the last half of the race.
Training: Do a search on 500 free under the workouts and see if Ande Rasmussen or some of the other prolific posters there have offered up ideas. I'd certainly recommend you work on on getting your "normal" 100 intervals down to 1:10s where you're comfortably going sub-1:05 and be able to do test sets on 1:05, ideally doing more than 5 at a time. At a very macro level, if you're really targeting the 500, I'd train the predominance of your early season training geared towards the 1000 to build endurance and then, as you add in quality, build more speed by training towards a 200 while keeping sufficient distance sets on your aerobic days at low rest, but a pretty good clip.
The 'moment of truth,' though where you need to learn to swim through the pain is from 300 to 450 yards.
Yikes! A 150 yard "moment" of truth is a darn long moment. I prefer the 200s where the "moment" of truth is just the third 50...
I have to agree with what people are saying. Looking at some guys going around 4:57 in the 500 free, I noticed that many of them swim the 200 free in 1:46/1:47. So that will be a challenge for you to overcome. Conditioning will be the key, and being able to pull off 10x100 on 1:10 and, especially 5x100 on 1:05 will be very important.
Can't wait to see what people say about how to break :50 in the 100 free. That's a goal you and I share.
Thanks for the tips so far, I love the idea of 5x100 on 1:05. It sounds somewhat scary but also not completely impossible. Right now I'm sure I can do 2. It'll be fun to try 3. Then 4, and so on. As for working on my 200 that will also be a good goal. I'm guessing that I probably don't need to get down to 1:46 but I should be down to 1:50 if I want to obtain 4:59. I'll most likely be approaching it more as distance swimmer where 500 is my sprint distance as opposed to a 100 swimmer where 500 is my long distance. Based on previous 500s and 1000s I tend to get into a rhythm pretty quickly and then am able to hold it for the remainder. I can imagine a way I might break 5:00 to be something like :57 followed by four 1:00 lows.
The great thing about masters is that you have years and years to achieve your goals. At only 32 I still have tons of time to just take off a few seconds a year and make it.
Keep the suggestions coming!
As for the sub-50 100 I just need to get more strength and speed, especially in my kick. The 50 was always way too short to get going for me. I just broke 24 for the first time in my life not too long ago. But the way I swim the 100 my second 50 is usually only a second slower than my first. I'm thinking if I can go out in a 24.0 then I can probably come back 25 mid to break it. The 200 and 500 training will help that a bit.
Keep the suggestions coming!
I should've made another comment on technique beyond your question on kicking. If you can, get your stroke videotaped and analyzed by a strong, technique-oriented coach. This will apply to both your 500 and your 100. While masters does allow us years and we can still hit the weights, I think many of us can benefit greatly from technique work.
After watching myself swim (both above and below the water), I've been making a number of changes to my stroke with an aim to increase my stroke length and reduce inefficiences / slippages in my pull. There are loads of great videos out there to watch, too, of the pros and a number of technique-oriented videos. The more efficient you can get your stroke, the less energy you use and the more effective / powerful you can be.
I'm guessing that I probably don't need to get down to 1:46 but I should be down to 1:50 if I want to obtain 4:59.
For comparison I consider myself a distance swimmer and my best masters times are 1:50 low in the 200 and 5:00 in the 500. Yes, I'm still trying to break 5:00. also. I should have last year, but didn't quite make it. I've now got so many swims within a couple seconds of 5:00 it's ridiculous!
Anyway, I think it is key to be able to take the race out in at least 1:56 unless you are a real negative split type swimmer. It is very difficult to keep those 50 splits under :30 in the middle part of the race (for me, anyway), so you need to build a little cushion in the front half of the race. Obviously that 1:55 or 1:56 at the 200 has to be pretty comfortable or you'll die in the back half. The 5x100 on the 1:05 is a good goal. I really do think it's key to know you can swim consistent 100s right around 1:00.
As someone else said, don't forget about the technique work. Things like turns are critical. With 19 turns if you can just cut a couple tenths off each turn it could make the difference between getting under 5:00 and swimming a 5:01. I should know! :)
For comparison I consider myself a distance swimmer and my best masters times are 1:50 low in the 200 and 5:00 in the 500. Yes, I'm still trying to break 5:00. also. I should have last year, but didn't quite make it. I've now got so many swims within a couple seconds of 5:00 it's ridiculous!
Anyway, I think it is key to be able to take the race out in at least 1:56 unless you are a real negative split type swimmer. It is very difficult to keep those 50 splits under :30 in the middle part of the race (for me, anyway), so you need to build a little cushion in the front half of the race. Obviously that 1:55 or 1:56 at the 200 has to be pretty comfortable or you'll die in the back half. The 5x100 on the 1:05 is a good goal. I really do think it's key to know you can swim consistent 100s right around 1:00.
As someone else said, don't forget about the technique work. Things like turns are critical. With 19 turns if you can just cut a couple tenths off each turn it could make the difference between getting under 5:00 and swimming a 5:01. I should know! :)
Kirk knows whereof he speaks:
Men 35-39 500 Freestyle
3 Nelson, Kirk E 37 PNA 5:01.77 5:00.37 8.00
27.24 56.70(29.46) 1:26.78(30.08) 1:56.94(30.16)
2:27.37(30.43) 2:57.81(30.44) 3:28.45(30.64) 3:59.46(31.01)
4:30.36(30.90) 5:00.37(30.01)
You can't get much closer than that over a 500.
If you want a pracice goal set, I can usually go under 5:00 for 500 yards free about the time when I can start making 5 X 100s on the 1:05 in practice.
Making that interval means that I can repeat and hold a pace close to a minute per hundred yards without dying.
You should work on getting your 200 free time faster, since I think you need to be comfortably at 1:55 at the 200 to make it under.
Good luck.
In my age group days, it took me forever to break. I was 5 minutes in my sophomore year of high school and I think that a few weeks later, I broke it or something. All I know is that I was only able to get in the low 4:50s and that was a struggle. I think that it was more mental than anything.
For this year, I would like to get around the 5:15 to 5:19 range and then, go from there. It would be really nice to eventually break 5 minutes again. We will see how my training goes. If it happens great, if not, oh well. I have so many other events to worry about as well.
In my age group days, it took me forever to break. I was 5 minutes in my sophomore year of high school and I think that a few weeks later, I broke it or something.
I remember it vividly. I went a 4:59 the very first dual meet my sophomore year in HS...then proceeded to not break it again for the rest of that season! I really don't know what went wrong.
Well, good luck! I will do a 500 sometime and post my splits here just for laughs. I wonder if my last 50 will be twice my first 50. I'm purely a sprinter.
