Kicker was a member of the national team wasn't he?
Do you believe he deliberately set out to cheat by taking the supplements?
- He took supplements knowing FULL WELL that he was responsible for what he was taking. He was not taking anything under a doctors supervision and was not required nor did he report what he was taking to anyone...he won a lawsuit against the supplement company...fine...but I still say his ban was legitimate because you just don;t take the risk these days.
Hopefully his case was enough to hammer it home for subsequent swimmers but is it the case that no swimmers are taking supplements these days?
- Obviously not...i doubt there are very many elite swimmers that aren't taking something such as creatine, cytomax, etc. etc. But its still no excuse, what you put in your body your responsible for...if in this age you want to risk it your a fool.
We know that some swimmers on the current Olympic team are taking supplements (E.g. Dara is very open about it, Larsen endorsed the same supplements that JH did). How does a swimmer know? Are all the swimmers that are taking any supplements idiots?
- If they have not had the product checked out and approved then they are playing russian roulette...
Rick was a member of the Olympic team.
Do you believe he deliberately set out to cheat? Given that he duly reported the drug he was taking to USOC it seems unlikely.
- Of course not..any anyone who knows him and the story knows that he got screwed. Can you not see the difference between coming forward and disclosing the use of a doctors prescribed medication from taking over the counter..or in the case of Clen, illegal substances??!!
Silken Laumann was a member of the Canadian national team.
She took the precaution of consulting with the team doctor to see if the cold med she wanted to take was ok and was told it was. Does the fact that he was wrong make her a lying cheater?
- See above....apples to oranges vs. JH
So I will continue to draw a distinction between having had a positive test and being a deliberate cheater, even if the vast majority of people with positive tests are deliberate cheaters, and I'll trust in the system to see through any nonsense that is thrown out. I'll give JH a little bit of time to come up with a plausible if not provable explanation before I assume she falls into the deliberate cheater category.
- You do a huge disservice and in my opinion insult Rick & Silken by lumping what JH in with happened in the JH case.
Add on: Paul, when you state categorically that she took supplements with Clen in them are you lumping in Clen as a drug that can be taken in pure form with supplements?
- Of course not...I have no idea where she got Clen...she's the one along with her attorney that as of yesterday started pointing the finger at Advocare for a tainted supplement.
Bottom line...if I'm an elite/professional swimmer taking over the counter supplements knowing the testing protocol that exists in swimming then I'm an idiot if i don't have those products tested to confirm they are legal...and even then i have to accept the risk that because supplements in this country are not regulated they can and do have things in them that are not always listed...so in conclusion ANYONE taking supplements is rolling the dice.
Kicker was a member of the national team wasn't he?
Do you believe he deliberately set out to cheat by taking the supplements?
- He took supplements knowing FULL WELL that he was responsible for what he was taking. He was not taking anything under a doctors supervision and was not required nor did he report what he was taking to anyone...he won a lawsuit against the supplement company...fine...but I still say his ban was legitimate because you just don;t take the risk these days.
Hopefully his case was enough to hammer it home for subsequent swimmers but is it the case that no swimmers are taking supplements these days?
- Obviously not...i doubt there are very many elite swimmers that aren't taking something such as creatine, cytomax, etc. etc. But its still no excuse, what you put in your body your responsible for...if in this age you want to risk it your a fool.
We know that some swimmers on the current Olympic team are taking supplements (E.g. Dara is very open about it, Larsen endorsed the same supplements that JH did). How does a swimmer know? Are all the swimmers that are taking any supplements idiots?
- If they have not had the product checked out and approved then they are playing russian roulette...
Rick was a member of the Olympic team.
Do you believe he deliberately set out to cheat? Given that he duly reported the drug he was taking to USOC it seems unlikely.
- Of course not..any anyone who knows him and the story knows that he got screwed. Can you not see the difference between coming forward and disclosing the use of a doctors prescribed medication from taking over the counter..or in the case of Clen, illegal substances??!!
Silken Laumann was a member of the Canadian national team.
She took the precaution of consulting with the team doctor to see if the cold med she wanted to take was ok and was told it was. Does the fact that he was wrong make her a lying cheater?
- See above....apples to oranges vs. JH
So I will continue to draw a distinction between having had a positive test and being a deliberate cheater, even if the vast majority of people with positive tests are deliberate cheaters, and I'll trust in the system to see through any nonsense that is thrown out. I'll give JH a little bit of time to come up with a plausible if not provable explanation before I assume she falls into the deliberate cheater category.
- You do a huge disservice and in my opinion insult Rick & Silken by lumping what JH in with happened in the JH case.
Add on: Paul, when you state categorically that she took supplements with Clen in them are you lumping in Clen as a drug that can be taken in pure form with supplements?
- Of course not...I have no idea where she got Clen...she's the one along with her attorney that as of yesterday started pointing the finger at Advocare for a tainted supplement.
Bottom line...if I'm an elite/professional swimmer taking over the counter supplements knowing the testing protocol that exists in swimming then I'm an idiot if i don't have those products tested to confirm they are legal...and even then i have to accept the risk that because supplements in this country are not regulated they can and do have things in them that are not always listed...so in conclusion ANYONE taking supplements is rolling the dice.
