As of 8:10am this morning one of the finer programs in the country is lost due to "budgetary" problems.
No one saw it coming and they just recently signed some top level recruits that gave them one of the top 3 recruiting classes in the country.
same male/female thing skews the men b/c of the amount of athletes on the football team. not all men play football.
it would be nice if the NCAA stepped in. clearly athletic departments are struggling to make ends meet, and the umbrella organization has taken a back seat while school after school picks on the same programs.
the whole world waits 4 years to watch track, swimming, gymnastics at the summer olympics. the world cup (soccer/futbol) is ginormous. why is the NCAA not taking advantage of the popularity of these sports to showcase developing talent?
Well, it's not the women's fault. It's football's and wussy ADs as Paul notes. More equity among sports scholarships is what's needed. How many of the 85 football scholarshps are for bench warmers? I just don't see how 85 scholarships for one sport is defensible.
Cutting women's olympic sports to have more men's olympic sports is not the answer and, as I said above, would unfairly penalize women. It would be nice if the NCAA stepped in. Otherwise, $$$ and the obsession with football rule.
Well, it's not the women's fault. It's football's. More equity among sports scholarships is what's needed. How many of the 85 football scholarshps are for bench warmers? I just don't see how 85 scholarships for one sport is defensible.
Cutting women's olympic sports to have more men's olympic sports is not the answer and, as I said above, would unfairly penalize women. It would be nice if the NCAA stepped in. Otherwise, $$$ and the obsession with football rule.
Don't you think what really needs to happen is a complete review/update of Title IX and a revision college sports programs around true overall participation rates of men and women in the general population? If the ratio of boys to girls in sports pre-college is 50/50 that should be a basis for how colleges are set up.
And football isn't the problem, the wussy AD's looking for quick fixes are the problem.
Holy Cow - I agree with Paul!!! Football still is a big problem because of the numbers of people it apparently requires. If you exclude football, you have caved but if you keep it in as is you haven't really solved any problem. Something clearly has to be done becasue ASU has shown their ass with their ridiculous spending on football and basketball and cutting of these sports this week.
The ASU decision is up there with the bone-headed decisions at places like Bowling Green and UCLA (the NCAA champion in women’s water polo). But the laws of gravity and economics don’t apply to swimming and football in the same way.
Back in the early 1970s, when Ohio State was doing some work on its football stadium, it invited the public to cart away squares of the turf – and the offer was over-subscribed by a lot. Flash forward to 2008: one of the most prosperous corners in Port Columbus is the airport store that sells red-and-white Ohio State clothing. You see, around a state that sends legislators to Columbus to vote on the budgets, the spirit of Buckeye football defies all the tools of financial analysis.
In the same way, dry cleaners in Arkansas will package your shirts in plastic bags with a family of red Razorbacks … there’s a guy who never did time in Chapel Hill's lecture halls but who nonetheless drives a Cadillac that's Carolina Blue … and the prize in the Red River Rivalry is more existential than words can describe, just as “the axe” is not the real prize when Cal plays Stanford. Swimming doesn’t inspire the depth of feelings that arise from football, to wit:
People who want to argue that we suck or that we are not worthy of what we have won or lost are just jealous of what the Buckeyes have accomplished year in and year out. Plain and simple.
No doubt about it: “Year in and year out,” Ohio State has been great - and its fans, even, "worthy" - notwithstanding those inconvenient losses in the first Thanksgiving Day games to a school that at the time had about 100 men (1890: Kenyon 18, OSU 0 … 1891: Kenyon 26, OSU 0 … 1892: OSU 26, Kenyon 10 … 1893: Kenyon 10, OSU 8): buckeyefansonly.com/gameresultsbyyear.html
In any case, The Buckeyes had their chance to make their first impression in their first season, when they came home with a 1-3 record. The Buckeyes lost their second game of football to the College of Wooster by a score of 64 to 0. Ouch.
If, as Fortress says,
Perhaps DIII schools will take over the collegiate swimming world, at least temporarily.
... then the reason is that, at small colleges, sports are just sports ... for the kids and not the fans ... I'm reminded of what someone else said: "it's only master's ..."
I think college athletics in general faces some big problems. The gap between the haves and have-nots is widening. The money involved in football and basketball is staggering - mostly because of TV. Those two sports are industries on their own. Football consumes the most scholarships by far, the most expense, and generates the most revenue for most schools. But football is not always profitable.
Like it or not - those two sports are also the ones the student body of most universities enjoys the most. These sports generate the most school spirit, the most national attention, etc.
Sit in a suite at (very long name) Texas' stadium and you will see how serious this money is. These suites are 650 sq. ft, have private bathrooms, catering, and electrically operated windows to allow the spectators to participate (or not). Burnt orange leather (!) upholstery. Schools are spending like mad on facilities and more to generate ever-more attention and revenue.
I will never begrudge what people do with their money. I mean the donors that help fund all this. But many universities have no ability to keep up with Texas and Ohio St, the two biggest spenders in the NCAA. Yet they are trying to compete on the field which needs money for facilities and crazy salaries for coaches.
These schools have a huge financial advantage over others. Texas can afford to fund other sports very well and still deal with Title IX.
I don't know how - but I'd like the NCAA to take some gutsy steps to reign in the arms race.
Geee....... You don't suppose "gender equity" was one of the components that had to do with her decision? Could that possibly mean the effects of Title IX had something to do with this? ...... :-)
Hmmmmmmmm
One has to wonder why you find "gender inequity" so desirable ...
Based on ASU's spending habits, the conclusion that it was a "last resort" is a bald faced lie.
You are gonna march to that beat for another 36 years I suspect so there's no changing your mind at all. Your opinion is well known. For those of us that have moved on from the early 70s, we'll try to find a solution. In the meantime, stock up on Kleenex, you need 'em.
Why do you harp on Title IX so? It's incredible that you find this such an easy target when ASU flat out spends tens of millions on basketball practice facilities and a coach's buyout clause. Someone who knows about finances would surely think that has a greater impact.
Let's be honest, ASU had 36 years to adjust to Title IX. Accusing Title IX now instead of ASU's inept administration is flat out ridiculous.
My personal view on Title IX's impact in this decision is that while it did play a limited role in three men's sports being cut, it probably played a MUCH BIGGER role in saving women's swimming, both diving programs (they probably have the same coach so cutting the men probably wouldn't have saved much, if any money) and probably several other women's sports.
My guess is that it wasn't a choice of cutting men's or women's swimming, for example. I bet they would have cut both if they could have.
Which is such a huge shame given the pool-based culture of the state...
Midas - good points. I think schools hide behind Title IX so as not to admit to financial stupidity. If a school can raise tens of millions for stadium improvements, they can figure out a way to save small sports. But, they chose not to and allow people to stand up and foolishly proclaim it's all about Title IX.
Midas - good points. I think schools hide behind Title IX so as not to admit to financial stupidity. If a school can raise tens of millions for stadium improvements, they can figure out a way to save small sports. But, they chose not to and allow people to stand up and foolishly proclaim it's all about Title IX.
Yep, it's the proverbial red herring scapegoat. I'm glad there are 25 schools I can delete from my kids' potential college list without any agonizing.
