After seeing a woman break 24 seconds and I think we can stop the discussion of "IF" the LZR suit is faster and start thinking "how much faster".
The previous line of suits (Fastskin and so on) were pretty similiar to a shaved swimmer. Sure - they do feel like they make you float, but overall the times seemed to move along "in line" with what I would expect to see in terms of improvements in the sport. If the previous suits would have been that much faster than shaving, you would have never seen people just using the legskins. By the way - for us Masters swimmers there was always the added benefit of keeping in all the "extra layers of skin".
So how much faster are the LZR suits ?
If I had to guess based on the results so far, I would say 0.25 to 0.30 per 50 and double that for the 100. I can see the Bernard going 48 low in the 100 and I can see Sullivan getting close or just breaking the 50 record. It makes sense that Libby Lenton would swim a 24.2 or so in the 50.
I think one of the top regular teams out there should do a test - you need a good amount of world class swimmers training together to be able to do a test. Here is the test I would propose:
8-10 swimmers
2 days of testing
4x50 on 10 minutes all out
Day 1 - swim 2 with a Fastskin2 followed by 2 with the LZR
Day 2 - swim 2 with the LZR followed by 2 with the Fastskin2
Get the averages of all 10 swimmers - maybe drop the high and low and there you go.
Why do the test ? I would HAVE to know. Swimming is a big part of your life and you just set a massive PR using this new technology - my very first question would be " How much was me and how much was the suit?"?
Leslie
I did some snooping at
www.usms.org/.../toptenind.php
you dropped from
31.61 in 2007 to
31.1 in 2008
that's good
I think 31.1 LCM is faster than 27.76 SCY
you also beat your 2007 31.37 SCM time
Ande
Thanks ande! I do tend to think converters are not very generous on the conversion for us old folks.
Also, forgot to mention another comparisons in SCM:
50 fly SCM, Dec. 2007: 31.3 (I think), fully tapered/Pro
50 fly, SCM, June 2008: 30.7, 1 week rest/B70
50 back SCM, Dec. 2007: 33.2, fully tapered/Pro
50 back SCM, June 2008: 31.7, 1 week rest/B70
100 back, SCM, Dec 2007: 1:13.9, tapered?Pro/15 minutes rest
100 back, SCM, June 2008: 1:11.7, one week rest/B70
Seems generally faster with the B70, although there are those niggly confounding factors! (The Pro I wore in Dec. also had seen about 6 meets. I think the Pros wear out quickly. I confirmed this at SCY zones by wearing a new Pro one day and an old Pro the next. Makes a difference, I thought. )
the other thing is
if you're doing speed / strength training
you don't need to rest much to hit your taper
since you're already kind of rested
when I'm doing a lot of aerobic longer training, for me,
resting can be trickier
I much prefer hit to my taper before my focus meet arrives
then maintain my taper,
rather than train harder closer to the meet then
resting hoping to hit my taper right when the meet starts
when I skip aerobic training to focus on speed and strength
I just need a short taper like a week or 2, though
some might consider the strength and speed work I'm doing as tapering.
When I'm strong in the weight room and fast in practice
I have confidence going into my meets
Thanks ande! I do tend to think converters are not very generous on the conversion for us old folks.
Also, forgot to mention another comparisons in SCM:
50 fly SCM, Dec. 2007: 31.3 (I think), fully tapered/Pro
50 fly, SCM, June 2008: 30.7, 1 week rest/B70
50 back SCM, Dec. 2007: 33.2, fully tapered/Pro
50 back SCM, June 2008: 31.7, 1 week rest/B70.
Seems generally faster with the B70, although there are those niggly confounding factors! (The Pro I wore in Dec. had seen about 6 meets. I think the Pros wear out quickly.)
the other thing is
if you're doing speed / strength training
you don't need to rest much to hit your taper
since you're already kind of rested
when I'm doing a lot of aerobic longer training, for me,
resting can be trickier
I much prefer hit to my taper before my focus meet arrives
then maintain my taper,
rather than train harder closer to the meet then
resting hoping to hit my taper right when the meet starts
when I skip aerobic training to focus on speed and strength
I just need a short taper like a week or 2, though
some might consider the strength and speed work I'm doing as tapering.
When I'm strong in the weight room and fast in practice
I have confidence going into my meets
After trying the 2 week taper at a few meets, I've concluded it's not for me IF I'm doing mostly strength/speed work. The involuntary 4 week "taper" is definitely NOT for me! I just can't finish a 100 well. I'm so scarred from my 100 fly LC at Zones I don't know if I'll ever try that again! Ideally (didn't happen quite the way I planned this summer), I would do a lot of aerobic work LC and then do a regular taper. I think one week is better SC. I don't enjoy aerobic work as much in SC. After a break, I'm going back to kicking and MF work for awhile.
Sorry about your slip in the 50 back, but good job to recover and do a nice time.
I hadn't heard: did you continue with your strength training after IGLA? Do you think it helped you here?
Sorry about your slip in the 50 back, but good job to recover and do a nice time.
I hadn't heard: did you continue with your strength training after IGLA? Do you think it helped you here?
Win some, lose some.
I did stick with the strength training after IGLA. I just hit a snag in late July and only lifted once (maybe twice) before Zones. Nonetheless, I do think the added strength was a "confounding" factor; I was, without a doubt, stronger than Zones last year. (But the interruption of training was probably a "confounding" factor too.) So, I don't think the times can be fully attributed to the suit. Plus, I try to continue to train smarter and probably did even more anaerobic work this year. I do wish I had gotten to swim the 100 back rested, but it was too close to the 50 fly. And when I said "unrested" above, it is more accurate to say I only rested a couple days.
Added a photo from Zones of Hulk and me in our B70s showing off our guns.
Added a photo from Zones of Hulk and me in our B70s showing off our guns.
Nice picture! But I have to say that it looks like Hulk could smash Fort without any trouble... :)
congrats on your swims
nice photo
y'all are rockin some serious guns
ande
Win some, lose some.
I did stick with the strength training after IGLA. I just hit a snag in late July and only lifted once (maybe twice) before Zones. Nonetheless, I do think the added strength was a "confounding" factor; I was, without a doubt, stronger than Zones last year. (But the interruption of training was probably a "confounding" factor too.) So, I don't think the times can be fully attributed to the suit. Plus, I try to continue to train smarter and probably did even more anaerobic work this year. I do wish I had gotten to swim the 100 back rested, but it was too close to the 50 fly. And when I said "unrested" above, it is more accurate to say I only rested a couple days.
Added a photo from Zones of Hulk and me in our B70s showing off our guns.
So Mr. Commings....he of the old school "briefs" apparently was ridiculed enough into at least trying a Blue 70...rumor has it Jeff that you swam faster than your current world record(s) in the 50/100 *** last week...care to share with us?
I only swam faster than my 50 *** world record. At least that's what Mark Rankin's watch showed me.
It wasn't ridicule that got me into the B70. It was a gentle sales pitch from Roque Santos at the ASCA clinic. I told him I planned to do a fast swim from the blocks in a couple of days, and he gave me a good-fitting B70 to test. As Paul said, I am a holdout of the old days. I can never stay mentally focused in a race while wearing a bodysuit. And I like the feel of water rushing over me. It lets me know how fast I'm going.
Anyway, here's the scoop on the swims. On Sunday, I did a 100 *** and felt like crap but still did OK (1:02.5 SCM). About 40 minutes later, I did a 28.16 (again, SCM) in the 50 ***.
Now, I've worn the LZR and the B70. Both are very good suits for different reasons, but I'm still not convinced that bodysuits are for breaststrokers, or at least this breaststroker. That pocket of air/water in the small of my back is distracting.
I only swam faster than my 50 *** world record. At least that's what Mark Rankin's watch showed me.
It wasn't ridicule that got me into the B70. It was a gentle sales pitch from Roque Santos at the ASCA clinic. I told him I planned to do a fast swim from the blocks in a couple of days, and he gave me a good-fitting B70 to test. As Paul said, I am a holdout of the old days. I can never stay mentally focused in a race while wearing a bodysuit. And I like the feel of water rushing over me. It lets me know how fast I'm going.
Anyway, here's the scoop on the swims. On Sunday, I did a 100 *** and felt like crap but still did OK (1:02.5 SCM). About 40 minutes later, I did a 28.16 (again, SCM) in the 50 ***.
Now, I've worn the LZR and the B70. Both are very good suits for different reasons, but I'm still not convinced that bodysuits are for breaststrokers, or at least this breaststroker. That pocket of air/water in the small of my back is distracting.
I want to make sure I have this right -- Succumbing to gentle sales pressure, you reluctantly throw on a B70 in practice, go close to world record 100m pace in your first swim, go a sub-world record 50 40 minutes later, and you're "still not convinced that bodysuits are for breaststrokers"? In part because you find an air/water pocket in the small of your back to be "distracting" as you are swimming at world record pace?
Are you kidding me?
Step away from the briefs. . .
