After seeing a woman break 24 seconds and I think we can stop the discussion of "IF" the LZR suit is faster and start thinking "how much faster".
The previous line of suits (Fastskin and so on) were pretty similiar to a shaved swimmer. Sure - they do feel like they make you float, but overall the times seemed to move along "in line" with what I would expect to see in terms of improvements in the sport. If the previous suits would have been that much faster than shaving, you would have never seen people just using the legskins. By the way - for us Masters swimmers there was always the added benefit of keeping in all the "extra layers of skin".
So how much faster are the LZR suits ?
If I had to guess based on the results so far, I would say 0.25 to 0.30 per 50 and double that for the 100. I can see the Bernard going 48 low in the 100 and I can see Sullivan getting close or just breaking the 50 record. It makes sense that Libby Lenton would swim a 24.2 or so in the 50.
I think one of the top regular teams out there should do a test - you need a good amount of world class swimmers training together to be able to do a test. Here is the test I would propose:
8-10 swimmers
2 days of testing
4x50 on 10 minutes all out
Day 1 - swim 2 with a Fastskin2 followed by 2 with the LZR
Day 2 - swim 2 with the LZR followed by 2 with the Fastskin2
Get the averages of all 10 swimmers - maybe drop the high and low and there you go.
Why do the test ? I would HAVE to know. Swimming is a big part of your life and you just set a massive PR using this new technology - my very first question would be " How much was me and how much was the suit?"?
Ande,
You contribute so much information on swimming in general to everyone I probably shouldn't have picked on you for the tech suits. Sorry about that, but I was in rant mode. You had some incredible swims at Nationals, but I don't believe the suits helped our times much or at all. I was next to you in the 50 free and the reason you went so fast is that your start and turn were very good and these don't seem like things the suit helps you much on.
O.K., here is another John Smith example since I am somewhat familiar with John Smith from college swimming. John, I apologize in advance for using you as an example twice. I think the example works equally well with your evil twin or any number of masters swimmers. Maybe John did swim slower at Nationals than he is capable of, but many swimmers did because it was late in the day on the last day. John in college was about 2 seconds faster than me in the 100 free. We both wore speedo briefs or another brand at the time. John has probably stayed in better shape than me over the years, but I am willing to say there is no difference there. We probably both trained as hard as we could in college and we probably train about the same now. We may have both swam slower than what we are capable of in the 100 at Nationals in Austin. I wore speedo briefs and John wore whatever tech suit he wore. The result was still almost exactly a 2 second difference. I don't think this is a coincidence. I think when a swimmer is prepared and on the blocks and ready to swim as fast as they can they swim virtually the same regardless of the suit they are wearing.
I am willing to take the risk that I am short changing my times and place in the masters swimming world. I just don't think I am risking much and personally ranking one or two places lower makes no difference to me. I realize that most people when they get to their taper meet are probably not willing to take the risk of not wearing a tech suit, but I think more people should try and I think it would have minimal impact their time and place.
One more thing, I think the tech suits do make you think about your body position more. After wearing the tech suit I do believe I made some adjustments to my body position. So, I did get some technique benefit from the tech suit which I am willing to concede.
Tim, feel free to rant all you want around here...thats part of the fun! It's even more fun when you can ruffle some feathers and or pull the "lurkers" out there into debates.
About the suits...this is just the latest in a long line of advancements in them, just as bikes have gotten lighter/stiffer, the golf club wars, etc. etc. Bottom line is as each generation is introduced and approved I will continue to move forward with using them.
And although you may not have seen a difference I can tell you first hand without any doubt there is a substantial difference for me in how fast my unrested swims are with one vs. without...we'll see in a week if the drops are the same but I'm guessing they will be smaller.
Ande,
You contribute so much information on swimming in general to everyone I probably shouldn't have picked on you for the tech suits. Sorry about that, but I was in rant mode. You had some incredible swims at Nationals, but I don't believe the suits helped our times much or at all. I was next to you in the 50 free and the reason you went so fast is that your start and turn were very good and these don't seem like things the suit helps you much on.
O.K., here is another John Smith example since I am somewhat familiar with John Smith from college swimming. John, I apologize in advance for using you as an example twice. I think the example works equally well with your evil twin or any number of masters swimmers. Maybe John did swim slower at Nationals than he is capable of, but many swimmers did because it was late in the day on the last day. John in college was about 2 seconds faster than me in the 100 free. We both wore speedo briefs or another brand at the time. John has probably stayed in better shape than me over the years, but I am willing to say there is no difference there. We probably both trained as hard as we could in college and we probably train about the same now. We may have both swam slower than what we are capable of in the 100 at Nationals in Austin. I wore speedo briefs and John wore whatever tech suit he wore. The result was still almost exactly a 2 second difference. I don't think this is a coincidence. I think when a swimmer is prepared and on the blocks and ready to swim as fast as they can they swim virtually the same regardless of the suit they are wearing.
I am willing to take the risk that I am short changing my times and place in the masters swimming world. I just don't think I am risking much and personally ranking one or two places lower makes no difference to me. I realize that most people when they get to their taper meet are probably not willing to take the risk of not wearing a tech suit, but I think more people should try and I think it would have minimal impact their time and place.
One more thing, I think the tech suits do make you think about your body position more. After wearing the tech suit I do believe I made some adjustments to my body position. So, I did get some technique benefit from the tech suit which I am willing to concede.
Tim, feel free to rant all you want around here...thats part of the fun! It's even more fun when you can ruffle some feathers and or pull the "lurkers" out there into debates.
About the suits...this is just the latest in a long line of advancements in them, just as bikes have gotten lighter/stiffer, the golf club wars, etc. etc. Bottom line is as each generation is introduced and approved I will continue to move forward with using them.
And although you may not have seen a difference I can tell you first hand without any doubt there is a substantial difference for me in how fast my unrested swims are with one vs. without...we'll see in a week if the drops are the same but I'm guessing they will be smaller.
