Always win, swim for fun!

abc, Kids are getting measured in everything. They already know your lesson. And they know life isn't fair. Having an activity where they get to take home a memento even if they are not "winners" would seem to be important. It levels the emotional playing field and keeps them in the sport. It is a sport, right? Regards, VB

I'm a mediocre-kinda-occasionally-fast-in-a-few-events kind of Masters swimmer. I never swam NCAA. I won't contend for any world records. But I am swimming Nationals. What should my goals be? I swam at USMS SCY nationals when my team hosted it, I think it was 2002 or 2003. Anyway, my goal was to swim my best, and enjoy the whole experience of a national event. It is so rare that an event of that magnitude is so convenient, that I'm glad I took advantage of the opportunity. And I wasn't the slowest in my age group in the events I did. That said, I kind of agree with abc. I certainly wouldn't travel a distance for just a swim meet, unless I could at least qualify for some events. I'm nowhere near any records, top 10 times, etc. I never swam on an organized team before I joined a masters swimming group. Even if I gave up my job and devoted all my time to swimming and working out I don't think I'd come close to any records. So I enjoy the experience of swimming with a team in a coached environment, certainly getting the physical benefits, and certainly great stress relief from the daily grind.

I don't want to get flamed too heavily here and from your past posts you seem like a very positive indvidual. In fact, it's a little cheesy. Again, I'm in no way discouting your opinions, but you sound like Oprah--just think in a positive manner and good things will happen. I'm more inclined to teach young swimmers that there are winners and losers. You won't be first all the time, in the pool and in life. It isn't bad to want to be number one, but you need to learn to cope with it when you aren't. I think the "Participant" ribbon is ridiculous, and I definitely don't believe that everyone is better off for just trying. There are people on this board who should have a goal of being the best in the world for their age group. There are people who don't have a chance and should therefore choose another goal or just enjoy the act of swimming. To each his own, but to downplay the rigors of competition in sport and in life seems somewhat naive to me.

ABC it is the Olympic spirit. "The most important thing in the Olympic Games is not to win but to take part, just as the most important thing in life is not the triumph but the struggle. The essential thing is not to have conquered but to have fought well."

I'm more inclined to teach young swimmers that there are winners and losers. You won't be first all the time, in the pool and in life. It isn't bad to want to be number one, but you need to learn to cope with it when you aren't. I think the "Participant" ribbon is ridiculous, and I definitely don't believe that everyone is better off for just trying. I'm more or less with you until the very last phrase. One of the nice things about swimming -- shared with a few other sports like track & field -- is that there is a pretty absolute measure of your performance. The clock doesn't lie (though my coach has a pretty itchy trigger finger sometimes). I definitely believe in the value of self-improvement, and sustained hard effort will almost always pay off in personal bests and similar achievements. "Be all you can be" may be corny but it is a good goal, I think. I'm not going to lie to my son and tell him he is the most talented or fastest swimmer around. He already knows that. But I love it when his face lights up when he drops significant time from his events. Should I berate him for not winning? Of course not. Competition should be used as a spur but it can be a deceptive yardstick. Would you rather win a race but do a poor time or vice versa? I like to win but given the choice I would much prefer a time improvement. There will always be someone faster, if not now then in the future (ie, all records are broken eventually).

There are people on this board who should have a goal of being the best in the world for their age group. There are people who don't have a chance and should therefore choose another goal or just enjoy the act of swimming. I'm a mediocre-kinda-occasionally-fast-in-a-few-events kind of Masters swimmer. I never swam NCAA. I won't contend for any world records. But I am swimming Nationals. What should my goals be?

I don't want to get flamed too heavily here and from your past posts you seem like a very positive indvidual. In fact, it's a little cheesy. Again, I'm in no way discouting your opinions, but you sound like Oprah--just think in a positive manner and good things will happen. I'm more inclined to teach young swimmers that there are winners and losers. You won't be first all the time, in the pool and in life. It isn't bad to want to be number one, but you need to learn to cope with it when you aren't. I think the "Participant" ribbon is ridiculous, and I definitely don't believe that everyone is better off for just trying. There are people on this board who should have a goal of being the best in the world for their age group. There are people who don't have a chance and should therefore choose another goal or just enjoy the act of swimming. To each his own, but to downplay the rigors of competition in sport and in life seems somewhat naive to me. Isn't that what JMiller is saying? More or less?

I don't want to get flamed too heavily here and from your past posts you seem like a very positive indvidual. In fact, it's a little cheesy. Again, I'm in no way discouting your opinions, but you sound like Oprah--just think in a positive manner and good things will happen. I'm more inclined to teach young swimmers that there are winners and losers. You won't be first all the time, in the pool and in life. It isn't bad to want to be number one, but you need to learn to cope with it when you aren't. I think the "Participant" ribbon is ridiculous, and I definitely don't believe that everyone is better off for just trying. There are people on this board who should have a goal of being the best in the world for their age group. There are people who don't have a chance and should therefore choose another goal or just enjoy the act of swimming. To each his own, but to downplay the rigors of competition in sport and in life seems somewhat naive to me. I completely agree with Chris' prior statement. I'm not a fan of the everyone is talented, special, smart, beautiful, gifted, amazing, etc. I guess they call it the "self esteem" theory for kids. You're not a good parent anymore unless you send your kid to speech therapy and small motors skills therapy at age 3 ... Yes, kids need encouragement and nurturing, but life is competitive and tough. Winning is fun, and not everyone wins in school, sports or life. For the very young just learning to swim, I think participation ribbons can help. My summer swim club doesn't have those, but we have "PB" ribbons. When a child does a personal best, they get a special ribbon. I know my then 6 year old was always happy to get her ribbons last summer even when she didn't win the race. As a master swimmer, it seems ridiculous to posit that you should "choose another sport" or "stop trying" if you can't be world ranked. Masters swimming allows myriad time-based goals and is a great sport to participate in as you age. I'm not going to quit just because Peg beat me in the 50 fly last weekend ... And when I can't do fly anymore (egads!), I'll even break down and do evilstroke.

GeoChuck, I’m definitely no expert when it comes to the Olympic Spirit, especially since I never made it to the Olympics. I am an Olympic Trials finalist and have received all the fortune and fame that comes along with being a runner up, which is nothing as far as I can tell :confused:. My goal was to not only make the Olympics, but to bring back an individual or relay medal. I didn’t just want to be a participant. For some, this may be true, for me, it never was. It’s the same reason why the news always broadcasts the medal counts for the various countries as opposed to giving a nightly update on which countries competed. I understand what you mean though, and can see the relevance. ViveBene, I like your comment about swimming being a sport, but as I’ve gotten older I’ve gotten more confused about what a "sport" is. To me, NASCAR is not a sport. Curling is not a sport. However, I think a sport has to involve competition, so my own definition doesn’t make sense b/c you definitely compete in NASCAR and Curling. Is knitting a sport? What about poker? I have no idea. Hoffam, your goals for nationals are unique to you and that’s the beauty of it. It doesn’t matter what I think, I’m just another idiot posting on a forum. If you don’t want any goals then don’t set any. However, I would at least set the goal of being alive and able to compete at another nationals if it were me. Aztimm, thanks for the honesty and at least a little agreement. At least I know I’m not completely crazy…yet, anway. Scyfreestyler, do you think Chuck Norris would agree with handing out “Participant” ribbons? I guess it’s possible, and who knows, maybe he does at his annual KarateFest. I don’t think that I am saying the same thing as JMiller either. He stated, “being the absolute freaky best, that concept is dysfunctional.” Why is it dysfunctional for some of the people on this board, especially when it comes to their age group? I don’t have a problem with it, would Chuck Norris?

I was lucky enough to be an Olympian but did not think to compete was better then winning. I was dissapointed after the Olympics because I went there to win. It did not workout for me and it was one of the things that I regret. I would have rather won. I retired from swimming and was never going to swim again. My coach asked me to swim in a relay to help our club and I agreed and was selected to swim in the Commonwealth Games, so I was drawn drawn back to swim. GeoChuck, I’m definitely no expert when it comes to the Olympic Spirit, especially since I never made it to the Olympics. I am an Olympic Trials finalist and have received all the fortune and fame that comes along with being a runner up, which is nothing as far as I can tell :confused:. My goal was to not only make the Olympics, but to bring back an individual or relay medal.