Dara Torres-Amazing

If I'm an idiot, then how come you're the one who is getting involved in a long argument about chemicals without knowing the meaning of the word "chemical." There are not "more chemicals" in supplements than in food, because both are entirely composed of chemicals. I give up. I suppose at the most technical level, yes everything on earth is made up entirely of chemical elements. You missed the point. Not surprising considering your obvious goal in any post you submit is to be combative, demeaning, or sarcastic. :whiteflag: There IS a higher concentration of SPECIFIC chemicals when one takes a supplement than there would be in grocery store food. I'm not writing a research paper, but I'll be sure in the future to write my posts as if I'm pursuing a Ph.D. Get a life.

I am not supporting her I am pointing out the fact that most people in her shoes would have done what she did. She was stupid and should have known better. She should have had better judgement and a better Lawyer.Hard to understand any of the side shows people are bringing up here. She took a banned substance and got caught. It's really that simple.

1 - You're an idiot. 2 - The levels of chemicals found in meats is very low compared to an OTC or "wellness store" supplement. Where are the chemicals in a salad? Eating grocery food store is not akin to taking supplements. I never claimed that foods aren't processed, but supplements are manufactured to administer a higher than normal dose of the desired {chemical, vitamin, protein} to the human as a means to enhance performance. "Stupid" is jumping in with a sarcastic comment that adds no value to the thread, especially when you either misread, didn't read, or couldn't read my post for what it said. If I'm an idiot, then how come you're the one who is getting involved in a long argument about chemicals without knowing the meaning of the word "chemical." There are not "more chemicals" in supplements than in food, because both are entirely composed of chemicals.

Keep in mind that her 100 BR has not improved at all over the same period of time in question since her breakout swim in 2005. Good point about the breastroke. But I guess I was not looking it it as deeply as you (regarding the comparison of Ockham's Razor)... I was looking at the situation more simply like if it looks like a duck, walks like a duck... it must be a duck - or whatever that phrase is. If I've gone off-course... I apologize. A claim of innocence doesn't mean squat nowadays... especially when it comes to cheating in athletics. Anyways, I'm sure everyone is on the edge of their seat wondering what the heck is going to happen here considering the opening ceremonies are 8 days away.

If this was a race you would be disqualified for jumping the gun. And we'd be waiting a decade for you to decide if you agreed with the results.

This was stupid when you posted it in the other thread, and it's still stupid. You're kidding yourself if you think that the food you buy in a grocery store is less of a "manufactured chemical compound" than something in a supplement bottle. 1 - You're an idiot. 2 - The levels of chemicals found in meats is very low compared to an OTC or "wellness store" supplement. Where are the chemicals in a salad? Eating grocery food store is not akin to taking supplements. I never claimed that foods aren't processed, but supplements are manufactured to administer a higher than normal dose of the desired {chemical, vitamin, protein} to the human as a means to enhance performance. "Stupid" is jumping in with a sarcastic comment that adds no value to the thread, especially when you either misread, didn't read, or couldn't read my post for what it said.

Wait for what? It's over. All we're waiting for is to determine the length of the ban on the odd chance there might be hypothetical, though implausible, mitigating circumstances that are more than just "I don't even know how to spell clenbuterol" posing. There is no question that she had banned substances in her system WHEN RACING that gave her an edge over her competitors.

Ok, here is my take and bottom line thinking on JH and PED. She had a great NCAA Swimming career going and was well liked at CAL and doing very, very well. She was well coached and was progressing very well. Then out of the blue with little or no warning, she turns PRO. She saw the dollar signs, the glitter, the neon, the possible huge money possibilities if she became a multiple Olympic Gold Medal Winner, then she made a decision to cheat by getting that extra edge by taking PED. She is very attractive, well educated, presents herself pretty well and figured she would cash in at any cost. BUT, she did it the wrong way by cheating and got caught. Now, her chances are slim and her future will always be tainted by PED and the underlying greed that drove the PED bus in the first place. She is guilty so don't kid yourself or be swindled into thinking otherwise.

I don't really understand how the "circumstances" are relevant. The WADA very clearly advises athletes that they are responsible for what they ingest. It's called personal responsibility. The implication is that these banned substances are ubiquitous and easily consumed unkowingly. That is not the case.

Answer this question - what could possibly be uncovered that would cause her not to have tested positive at Trials and therefore have a competitive advantage over her rivals? Don't dodge the question, answer it.