Stroke Rate vs Stroke Length, which is more difficult?
Former Member
This topic may have been discussed in the past but a search gave too many hits. I am very interested by your comment and advices for the following real scenario. This is for kids but may be this could apply to masters. BTW, I am just a parent swimmer, very interested in swimming in general but unfortunately not a good enough swimmer.
Two age group swimmers (11-12 years old) coming from different swimming history have opposite swimming style:
Swimmer 1 (let's call the higher stroke rate swimmer) swims 50 meters freestyle, taking 60 strokes. Swimmer2 does it in 45 strokes, with a time 0.5 to 1 second slower.
In general, Swimmer1 beats Swimmer2 in all distances (freestyle and back). Including a 2000 meter freestyle test set, faster by about 20 seconds. In this particular 2000m, aside the time and stroke rate, Swimmer2 (slower stroke rate) did it with even splits while Swimmer1 positive splits toward the last 25% of the distance.
Q1. Assuming two swimmers have similar aerobic conditions, which one will have better margin of progression? More exactly, would it be "easier" for Swimmer1 to improve the technique or for Swimmer2 to improve the Stroke Rate?
Q2. What would you recommend to these swimmers to get better?
To these two swimmers, stroke rate seems to be the winning bet. Swimmer2 was taught with a focus on excellent technique (and indeed looks better in the water), but is confused as this skill doesn't translate into better performance.
Of course, we are talking about SL and SR relative to a context where the swimmers already know about swimming.
Thanks you in advance for your help.
Parents
Former Member
Swimming low and/or swimming TI is not designed for speed swimming; it is designed to minimize drag and enjoy swimming with an effortless-looking stroke. It is more for pleasure.
In fact what I meant Donna, was that ok... let me put all that into perspective.
Goal : Lowering the 50meter U30seconds
Actual time : 40sec
Method : Learn to swim better using TI
For more than a year (probably), the subject has to learn TI drills, increase slippery, lower stroke count. Learning to travel efficientely Under water while pushing off the walls and everything.
But no one race like that of course. Not over 50m. What's the name of the game over 50m? Kick kick kick. What happens then?
When you see a fast-moving sprinter with most of the back exposed, you'd naturally tend to believe you're seeing hydroplaning at work. What you are really seeing is a deeper bow wave being cut by that swimmer. And there is a massive energy cost to creating such a wave I've never seen a freestyle sprinter performing a sprint being low. Reason for this (in my humble opinion), is that so much downward force is being applied (huge kick, very high stroke rate) that is has a lifting effect.
So it doesn't really matter how low or high the subject in my example is while performing TI drills and learnings, when he lights up the kick engine during a 50m sprint, the subject will end up on top of the water, not under.
*** edit **
I think I understand what's going on in the debate...
TI doesn't include sprinting specific drills I think. Not in the yellow book (which is outdated though). And maybe *not yet*. I don't know, only Terry could confirm.
So you're right in saying that TI doesn't turn you into a sprinter. It will turn you into a swimmer though, which is already a hell of a start.
Swimming low and/or swimming TI is not designed for speed swimming; it is designed to minimize drag and enjoy swimming with an effortless-looking stroke. It is more for pleasure.
In fact what I meant Donna, was that ok... let me put all that into perspective.
Goal : Lowering the 50meter U30seconds
Actual time : 40sec
Method : Learn to swim better using TI
For more than a year (probably), the subject has to learn TI drills, increase slippery, lower stroke count. Learning to travel efficientely Under water while pushing off the walls and everything.
But no one race like that of course. Not over 50m. What's the name of the game over 50m? Kick kick kick. What happens then?
When you see a fast-moving sprinter with most of the back exposed, you'd naturally tend to believe you're seeing hydroplaning at work. What you are really seeing is a deeper bow wave being cut by that swimmer. And there is a massive energy cost to creating such a wave I've never seen a freestyle sprinter performing a sprint being low. Reason for this (in my humble opinion), is that so much downward force is being applied (huge kick, very high stroke rate) that is has a lifting effect.
So it doesn't really matter how low or high the subject in my example is while performing TI drills and learnings, when he lights up the kick engine during a 50m sprint, the subject will end up on top of the water, not under.
*** edit **
I think I understand what's going on in the debate...
TI doesn't include sprinting specific drills I think. Not in the yellow book (which is outdated though). And maybe *not yet*. I don't know, only Terry could confirm.
So you're right in saying that TI doesn't turn you into a sprinter. It will turn you into a swimmer though, which is already a hell of a start.
