Stroke Rate vs Stroke Length, which is more difficult?
Former Member
This topic may have been discussed in the past but a search gave too many hits. I am very interested by your comment and advices for the following real scenario. This is for kids but may be this could apply to masters. BTW, I am just a parent swimmer, very interested in swimming in general but unfortunately not a good enough swimmer.
Two age group swimmers (11-12 years old) coming from different swimming history have opposite swimming style:
Swimmer 1 (let's call the higher stroke rate swimmer) swims 50 meters freestyle, taking 60 strokes. Swimmer2 does it in 45 strokes, with a time 0.5 to 1 second slower.
In general, Swimmer1 beats Swimmer2 in all distances (freestyle and back). Including a 2000 meter freestyle test set, faster by about 20 seconds. In this particular 2000m, aside the time and stroke rate, Swimmer2 (slower stroke rate) did it with even splits while Swimmer1 positive splits toward the last 25% of the distance.
Q1. Assuming two swimmers have similar aerobic conditions, which one will have better margin of progression? More exactly, would it be "easier" for Swimmer1 to improve the technique or for Swimmer2 to improve the Stroke Rate?
Q2. What would you recommend to these swimmers to get better?
To these two swimmers, stroke rate seems to be the winning bet. Swimmer2 was taught with a focus on excellent technique (and indeed looks better in the water), but is confused as this skill doesn't translate into better performance.
Of course, we are talking about SL and SR relative to a context where the swimmers already know about swimming.
Thanks you in advance for your help.
Parents
Former Member
Allen,
"The theory is that the end push of free(from the hips back) is relatively inefficient."
I had not heard this, but I am sure it is out there. I wonder why the people doing studies on this think the end push of free can be inefficient. Does it have something to do with: for as little benefit that a swimmer may receive from this end push, it would be better for them to stop short and start the next pull instead? This is the only thing I can think of, but I haven't a clue on this one.
But I can see where people may think that hip rotation does provide more power and it will streamline a swimmer. I think that both of these things happen. I know I can feel the power generated and because I rotate, I get a much larger catch of water, thus lowering my stroke per length.
I've never been a freestyle sprinter; only backstroke, and I can't remember my SPL, but it was higher than my free. The only thing I have experienced is when sprinting a 50 free, my entire stroke has to be shortened up all the way through it, and I don't much like that feeling of high-turnover and going nowhere fast; not thrashing, just an inefficient sprint freestyle stroke to me. I just have never been a freestyle sprinter and I'm not starting now.
And it would be good to see Terry's remarks on this as he has been swimming forever and has been associated with good coaches and swimmers. I am sure he may be able to give us something to think about.
And, when will George be back? I believe he thinks shoulder rolling is a good thing, I think I saw him write that once.
Donna
Allen,
"The theory is that the end push of free(from the hips back) is relatively inefficient."
I had not heard this, but I am sure it is out there. I wonder why the people doing studies on this think the end push of free can be inefficient. Does it have something to do with: for as little benefit that a swimmer may receive from this end push, it would be better for them to stop short and start the next pull instead? This is the only thing I can think of, but I haven't a clue on this one.
But I can see where people may think that hip rotation does provide more power and it will streamline a swimmer. I think that both of these things happen. I know I can feel the power generated and because I rotate, I get a much larger catch of water, thus lowering my stroke per length.
I've never been a freestyle sprinter; only backstroke, and I can't remember my SPL, but it was higher than my free. The only thing I have experienced is when sprinting a 50 free, my entire stroke has to be shortened up all the way through it, and I don't much like that feeling of high-turnover and going nowhere fast; not thrashing, just an inefficient sprint freestyle stroke to me. I just have never been a freestyle sprinter and I'm not starting now.
And it would be good to see Terry's remarks on this as he has been swimming forever and has been associated with good coaches and swimmers. I am sure he may be able to give us something to think about.
And, when will George be back? I believe he thinks shoulder rolling is a good thing, I think I saw him write that once.
Donna
