Should USA Swimming recruit?

Hi Paul: Who is going to come up with the cash? The Government, Sponsors, USA Swimming, Clubs? How will this effect the development of the National team? How would people like Michael and Amanda feel about this bought guaranteed talent as opposted to them hustling sponsors to get funding? If look at Qater they don't have these problems because they don't have any developed swimmers or teams on the world class level. They do have major riches and they can provide the funds to develop swimmers into world class champions. They want to take the short cut and get others and possibly in the future they can develop some of their own from this experience. They have this facility over in Qater that's named after the Sheik Hamad whose family has ruled the country since 1995. I have read that the Hamad International complex makes places like IUPUI, Rose Bowl, and old Mission Bay look dinky and small by comparison. They have these facilities and have no world class swimmers to train in them. Plus they have so much cash they don't know what to do with it. I don't see the same set of circumstances over here with our economy and the war going on right now. Plus I don't know what swimming would be like if the developed nations in the sport would start doing this. Here is a link to the nation of Qater. www.qatarembassy.net/clubs.asp www.explore-qatar.com/sports.html

The door has been thrown wide open.........no turning back now. Question is when (not if) other countries follow this same path, which has been my point all along. As for how will Michael and Amanda feel, I would ask how Lezak, Brunelli, Crocker and Walker will feel if they lose the 400 free relay to Qatar? Not such a long shot if the country keeps throwing cash around and if there are no restrictions on citizenship...........? So why not have the US do the same? Seems like a good percentage of the people polled on this site don't see any problems training and giving foreign athletes scholorships so lets see if those same people would support this?!

Paul: I not sure if there is a parallel with a university giving a scholarship to a foreign athlete to swim for the school in exchange for a funded education and a rich country paying millions of dollars to have the best athletes swim for there nation. This has been going on in track in Qater and no other nations had followed suit. So far in swimming, 3 offers have been made to swimmers we know about and only 1 has accepted because of a lack of funding in Croatia. To get swimmers that you are talking about like Hoogie and Thorpe would break the bank. If you notice so far they have not gone to developed traditional powers in swimming. They have stated in the countries that don't have big national teams and swimmers that are from poor countries that don't have major funds to keep the swimmers swimming. Duje Draganja is done with college and unless he stays here on an extended visa or applies for dual citizenship he will have to go back to Croatia and train there, which is something he has not done in over 4 years. Along comes this offer and it opens up possibilities for himself. Right now in the USA, nobody is going to come up with that kind of cash in an amateur sport like swimming. Even though we have professional swimmers right now, the organization of USA swimming is not run like a professional league like the NBA, NFL, and MLB where owners have lots of cash to pay there established pros because everyone that plays is a professional. That is not the case with USA swimming and its development. There are no professional leagues and no NSL. Professionals train and compete against the amateurs. Amateurs being the NCAA swimmers and others that do not make or take funding for swimming. If we had a professional league and owners than this might be able to happen but without it, it won't happen. As far as the USA losing the 400 Free Relay to Qater in 2008, we will see. I still can't believe that South Africa did not defend there title last year in Montreal when they could have easily put a great relay together with the swimmers they had there. Talk about ducking a challenge.

What about corporate sponsors? Coke vs Pepsi for the 400 free relay? They sponsor athletes already, why not let them buy a whole team?

Originally posted by Frank Thompson I not sure if there is a parallel with a university giving a scholarship to a foreign athlete to swim for the school in exchange for a funded education and a rich country paying millions of dollars to have the best athletes swim for there nation. What do you see as the difference between universities recruiting and paying swimmers (foreign or otherwise) to swim on their team and countries recruiting and paying swimmers to swim on their team?

fatboy........that's already happening, but i think we're seeing a whole new level here with what Qatar is doing. Hey Phil, maybe during opening ceremonies each individual athlete can carry their corporate sponsor sign and play their jingle during the awards ceremony, but wait that may produce unwanted "nationalism" as well!! :)

Actually, I fully understood your point, it's the same point people use when they think our industries will be more competitive by limiting our exposure to the competition. Maybe my kids and my neighbors' kids will have fuller lives due to their education with the brightest worldwide. There might still be a few unaccredited universities out there for your kids and your neighbors kids with this outdated philosophy. Competition makes more efficient industries, it's called capitalism. Putting up artificial barriers to protect your own industries hasn't traditionally proven to be such a good policy, unless, of course, you are Fidel Castro. I do prefer American jeans, however.

I think it is a little humerous that we still hold to the notion that sports should uphold some kind of amateur, "we do this sport because we love it" type of persona. The almighty dollar rules, whether it is American or foriegn. The majority of todays youth, not all, only participates in sports for the external reward and not the internal. I'm starting to think that recruiting in a global market just might help swimming grow..... Only time will tell.

Originally posted by Dennis Tesch The majority of todays youth, not all, only participates in sports for the external reward and not the internal. Huh? The vast majority of athletes never earn a single dime professionally. And, I'm not talking 51%, it's like 99.9%.

I don't think anyone is missing the point, John. I have gone through post-graduate education with many foreign students. These students often received the same scholarship, or better, than I had. I found them usually talented and hard working. I found that they improved the quality of the school, the research, and my education. I am glad they were there. I am glad federal money was spent on them. I would rather federal money be spent of good foreign students than feceral money be spent on mediocre domestic students. Our country is nothing but helped by good universities and good research. The research programs are a certain size. If there were enough domestic students to do the work (note, this is five or six years of near slave labor) then they would do the work. If there aren't enough domestic students, foreign students will be brought in. The big threat to long-term national security are the limitations placed by the government on student visas. This will hurt this country's research and economy. Except that a research program is far more important to the health of a university than a swimming team is, I think the analogy between aid for graduate students and aid for swimmers is very close. On the topic of this thread, Qatar can buy atheletes if it wants, it does not have to. The United States can buy athletes if it wants, but it does not have to. I do not think it is a good idea for the United States to be buying athletes, it has plenty of good ones as it is, and I would rather spend the money on better research. And the pros can march under whatever flag they want, corporate or national. I could care less. Perhaps the real difference between me and John and Paul is that I am totally disillusioned about international sports altogether. There is no idealistic value to it. It is just a competition between people who are really good at what they do, and usually the things that they do are pretty arbitrarily set up. Getting this confused encourages some countries to cheat, and other countries to go nearly bankrupt holding a sporting event. Not worth it.