I've noticed at lot of dicsussion in recent threads about TI principles,
As you can see from my location, I'm on the other side of the atlantic and TI has started to make an impact over here.
I've come across a lot of people in my local University pool who seem to have been mesmerised by the TI message and it is now common for me to see people swimming on their sides with one outstreached arm and a submerged head.
When the time comes to breath these guys have their heads so deep from pressing their bouy that they end up lifting it so high that they loose whatever alignment they had in the first place.
From talking to them, none of them seem to want to develop a proper kick and build up endurance so they can develop
good form.
I have decided to post a list of TI priciples and my own critism of these, feel free to add to the list or post a TI defence!
TI PRINCIPLE 1
Side to Side Rotation
to get into Low Drag Fish-like Position
Criticism
Rotation is good to get extentsion and
a good catch + power into the stroke,
Excessive rotation slows down the stroke.
TI PRINCIPLE 2
Swim DownHill
Press your Bouy
Criticism:
Holding head too deep creates drag
Makes breathing Difficult
TI PRINCIPLE 3
No Kicking
Criticism
Kicking essential to fast swimming
+ to maintain good form particularly
for male swimmers.
TI PRINCIPLE 4
Front Quadrant Swimming/
Distance per stroke,
Criticism
A reasonably high Stroke rate is necessay for
fast swimming,
Unless you have a very strong kick a glide
phase in your stroke will cause decelleration
TI PRINCIPLE 5
Drills will make you a better swimmer
Criticism
Drills are important, but there is no
substitute for good quality fast training.
Former Member
I think we doth get too technical. Just swimming with the spine strait, head in the right position making sure that each shoulder is clear of the water as the arm is in the recovery stage, don't drop the elbow while taking your hand to the catch and max from the catch to the finish is all we have to do. Swim, swim, swim and the stroke will improve on its own. All the reading and videos are not necessary.
The really fast boats plane on top of the water.
Why does a discussion of TI always seem reminiscent of a discussion of religion or politics? This reminds me of the story of the blind men and the elephant. We watch an elite swimmer and dissect his stroke, then argue that the key is distance per stroke (carried to the extreme of a pronounced glide), or rotation (carried to the extreme of swimming on your side), or not rushing the catch (carried to the extreme of a catch up style), etc. I maintain that TI tries to reduce something that's very complex and intimately related to level of fitness to a set of drills that anyone can learn. I don't dispute the value of doing some drills during warmup, but then spend the rest of your workout at En2 and En3. And don't forget the strength training. I believe those America's Cup yachts with the long waterline need wind and substantial sails to make them go fast.
Correct me if I'm wrong....but doesn't Ion Thorpe pretty much follow the principles of TI with his long (almost catch up style) form of freestyle?...and he was a successful Olympian (of a sorts right?)
Newmastersswimmer
Originally posted by knelson
And of course all these swimmers are sprinters . It seems to me stroke rate is much more important for sprinters.
...
I don't have the book handy.
What I quoted is from my notes.
Kozulj's 200 back is not a sprint, and in the book it goes how I remember it, Bottom seeing Kozulj doing X strokes per 50, Bottom wanting Y strokes per 50 like the stats in a big meet, working to increase Kozulj's Stroke Rate (against T.I.'s belief), and Kozulj winning 200 back at the 2000 European Championships in a Personal Best of 1:58.
Quod Erat Demonstratum regarding Stroke Rate
Originally posted by knelson
And of course all these swimmers are sprinters . It seems to me stroke rate is much more important for sprinters. However, once you start swimming longer races reducing drag becomes more and more important. Sprinters can take the tradeoff of greatly increased propulsive force by slightly increasing their drag. Distance swimmer cannot.
Why do you think stroke length is about drag and stroke rate is about propulsion? Think about men versus women. Stroke rates are about the same, but men take longer strokes. Women are smaller and obviously create less drag, but men are stronger. Strength must be an important element in stroke length.
TI is actually an accumulation of the ideas of coaches from as far back as the forties, it is based on all the things that my coach and other coaches had thought of and refined into a great sales pitch.
This does not say it is not good but to me it is not the end all and be all to swim well. Things are added as they are developed. Like Swim Down Hill that was taught by Matt Mann in the 50s, front quadrant swimming as the Japanese came up with in the 50s, S stroke in the 50s. Terry compiled these well, he was not the inventor. It is a good sales package. But you do not win races by just lowering your stroke count.
The windmill style went out with a swimmer we called Windmill Willie in 1948.
Originally posted by geochuck
Does any one really think that good technique is Laughlin's idea or that we don't have to workout to swim fast?
It's fine to say "good technique", "swim longer", "improve your conditioning", but the arguments come from how you do those ideas.
Take conditioning. For most of us, more is better. But more sprinting? Less rest? Some people advocate lifting weights, others say don't do it. At what point am I wearing down muscle instead of developing it? The devil is in the details.
As far as good technique, it may not be as mainstream as you think. Many swimmers, when sprinting, put in more effort without concern about their stroke breaking down.
Originally posted by geochuck
When I train fast I use good technique.
And that is the goal of TI. To teach people *how* to maintain good technique when swimming fast. (When I read the books, Laughlin always states that improved conditioning will lead to faster swims. His emphasis is that improved technique can lead to large rewards.)
(BTW, while I've read the books, I have never gone to a clinic. I am trying to argue the ideas, not brainwash you. :D In my experience as a scientist, often you don't really understand something, right or wrong, unless you try to teach it or vigorously argue it.)
