There has been a lot of discussion since Athens about foreign swimmers training in the United States. Most of them attend U.S. Universities, receive athletic scholarships, and compete at NCAA's. Some notable examples include Duje Draganja (Cal), Fred Bousquet and Kirsty Coventry (Auburn), Markus Rogan (Stanford), and the South African sprinters (Arizona). Some train in the U.S., but don't compete for a university (Inge de Bruijn). All of these athletes benefit from U.S. coaching, from training with U.S. swimmers, and in some cases, from financial support provided by U.S. entities (athletic scholarships). They all turn around and then win medals for other countries.
A couple questions: 1) What do you think about this arrangement generally? 2) Is it of benefit or detriment to U.S. swimming to have these foreign athletes training and competing here? 3) Should we be giving athletic scholarships, which are a scarce resource in swimming, to foreign athletes who will represent their own countries internationally instead of U.S.-born swimmers who will represent us internationally?
I'm sure there are other issues, but these come directly to mind.
A couple of points of clarification:
- Any athlete that wants to come her and train who pays their own way I have no problem with..........however I do have a problem with our subsidizing this training via college scholoraships (which are often paid for with tax dollars to the university).
- I do have a problem with the Olympics allowing athletes to compete for any country that pays them but does not require them to have citizenship..........contrary to Phil's position of wanting all sports to be about individuals vs. countries or teams. (PS: geek........as far as I know both Duncan and Lenny obtained citizenship here....!!)
- Geek......I'll check my stats but can assure you that a lot of the Kenyons dominating running events train here in the US, again I don't have any issue with that if their country is paying the way or their using their own funds.
PS: so how do you feel about the ice skating couple from the US who they just found out one is an illegal alien........?A whole nother topic there eh?!
Originally posted by Paul Smith
PS: so how do you feel about the ice skating couple from the US who they just found out one is an illegal alien........?A whole nother topic there eh?!
It's a little disturbing that you are up to date on ice skating news. I'd expect that from Cruise, but not you.
Hey Lindsay......seems we've been down this path before:
- So how many colleges in Canada provide hockey scholorships to US citizens?
- See a lot of schools in Mexico paying soccer scholorships to US athletes as well......same in France.
Your welcome to come down here and train....would love to have you...but don't ask me to pay for it. I wouldn't do the same if I wanted to come to your country......and I would be considered scum by the way!!
Geek........I'm like an onion; many, many layers that may surprise you!
Originally posted by White Buffalo
Geek, I am somewhat taken aback by your "unique" arguments and attacks on individuals. The fact is this is a swimming forum, so whether the USA medaled in table tennis, horse jumping or pistol shooting, in my opinion, is beyond the scope of discussion.
You obviously have not realized it's important to alter the subject enough so that logical arguments as presented by a Smith are nullified.
BTW - Buffalos can't swim, why are you on this forum? It's a swim forum after all.
White Buffalo:
I believe the USA did not get shut out at the 2004 Olympics in the 50 Free. Gary Hall Jr won the gold medal with a time of :21.93 and was the defending Olympic Champion from 2000. Gary can become the first American Man to win 3 Gold Medals in the same event at the Olympics in 2008.
Originally posted by Phil Arcuni
For that matter, I resent it when Cal gives scholarships to Texan or North Carolinean swimmers. These scholarships are paid by *my* tax dollars, not theirs!
This is actually a pretty valid point. Since most universities rely on funding from state taxes, there really isn't any difference between giving a North Carolinian a scholarship to a California school versus a Lithuanian.
I hadn't contemplated this point.
Oh no, not that silly argument again, which has been roundly lampooned time and again on this forum.
Let's give his medal to Qatar, for the right price.
Matt S.,
The medley relay for the US lately has been a function of Texas swimming. 3 out of 4 have been developed by Eddie. Might I add that Neil Walker (another Longhorn) is also a force to be reckon with for the 4th position on that relay. Eddie has always placed strong emphasis on his sprint program and had great successes in the 200 and below. I would not draw parallels with Eddie's coaching philosophies with that of US swimming and other coaches at large. He is usually a decade or more ahead in his thought process, techniques and programs.
John Smith
As off track as Phil is, he does have a point about Texans & geeks from NC!
Hell John.......we've been trying to get you out of Colorado since you arrived!
