Learning to fly

Originally posted by BillS .... Can a 44 year old lousy kicker learn to fly? .... Yes. Try this forum post I made recently that collects some threads here, and some useful links: forums.usms.org/showthread.php LindsayNB made a lot of good points here, especially #2, 3, & 5 if you are just starting out. I seem to recall seeing photos of some Olympian that looked like they bent their knees rather significantly on the kick (though I agree, that action can drop you like a stone)... hummm... the opinion mill starts. (Actually I saw this photo in a 06-25-2004 by LindsayNB.) Here are some additional notes I just made for myself: Coach Hines says: "My philosophy is that successfully racing 200 fly requires the ability to swim relaxed fly at a moderate pace for 500 yards." He does this with his "half-fly" practice method. - from p11 of the Mar-Apr-05 issue of USMS Swimmer. The same article quoted swimmer/coach Dennis Baker saying: "Most people have a problem with their timing... trying to kick down while their arms are pulling down." His solution is to not kick at all, just let the legs drag and follow the hips, and add the timing of the kick later. I agree that when done right butterfly (like all strokes) should feel as smooth as silk. And timing is everything! Far more critical than all the other strokes combined probably, especially for looking (and feeling) even halfway presentable when you do it. One bit I recall seeing somewhere recently is that authorities (coaches) will often differ on opinion on certain aspects of swimming technique, but when the majority of them agree on the same item, then you can pretty well bet that it is important, and worth further scrutiny. You will just need to glean through all the opinions, try stuff for yourself (like keeping the hips up), and decide what works best for you. When I began earnestly practicing butterfly I was told I needed a good kick (which is true), and that I'd get a nice set of six-pack abs (I'm still waiting for that, but I'm starting to feel it). But the paradox is that it was not until I quit trying to kick that I was able to develop a good rhythm (as coach Baker, and others, confirm). As my conditioning developed and I was able to stay more horizontal (as opposed to tiring and slipping into the vertical butter-struggle), I slowly began to develop the right kick, along with that "core" strength and "undulating" movement you hear so much about (that seems so elusive till you get it). With Butterfly you will know when you hit it. It is quite the revealing moment of clarity. Of course then the task is then to be able to maintain that moment. (Practice, study, practice, study, practice, practice, etc.) I have a ways to go before I sign up for the 200 fly, but I'm thinking I can see it now on the horizon. I'm 6'2", 185#, and 46y/o... I've been practicing fly now for about 2 years, and I'm able to knock off 50's without much effort. I'm really enjoying it now, especially those first few 50's. But when I really learn is when I start to get tired and can still maintain my form (for me it takes a lot of concentration). I agree 100% that when you start to fall apart you need to quit, or switch to something else (another stroke, kick drills on your back, etc.). I've never used any props (fins, kick board, etc.), but umpty-ump number of swimmers can't be wrong, so I'm sure they will help shorten the learning curve. But I'm no expert either. expert \`ek-spert\ n - "x" = the unknown factor, "spurt" = a drip under pressure. :-) One thing I've been focusing on recently that really seems to help, especially when I feel fatigue starting to creep in, is to really stretch out where you can put some glide into your stroke. Open the chest really wide with the arms fully extended (you should feel a really good stretch along your sides, almost into your lats), pulling your elbows back behind you (up towards the surface). It helps to have some forward motion (as described in the slipping action getting from under the water over your back). I can get a longer pull this way, which makes it easier to generate the thrust to grab that breath. I can be almost at a standstill and still keep fairly decent form with this method when I start getting tired. Momentum certainly does help though. When I do this well rested, and keeping my hips up (legs trailing behind), the stroke really flows. There is little doubt to me that this sets you up for that undulating motion so often mentioned. I recall seeing a photo in Scott Rabalais' (Duck & Dive) article that illustrated this position very well. I wish I could recall which issue of SWIM Magazine it was in. Have Fun!

Originally posted by BillS .... Can a 44 year old lousy kicker learn to fly? .... Yes. Try this forum post I made recently that collects some threads here, and some useful links: forums.usms.org/showthread.php LindsayNB made a lot of good points here, especially #2, 3, & 5 if you are just starting out. I seem to recall seeing photos of some Olympian that looked like they bent their knees rather significantly on the kick (though I agree, that action can drop you like a stone)... hummm... the opinion mill starts. (Actually I saw this photo in a 06-25-2004 by LindsayNB.) Here are some additional notes I just made for myself: Coach Hines says: "My philosophy is that successfully racing 200 fly requires the ability to swim relaxed fly at a moderate pace for 500 yards." He does this with his "half-fly" practice method. - from p11 of the Mar-Apr-05 issue of USMS Swimmer. The same article quoted swimmer/coach Dennis Baker saying: "Most people have a problem with their timing... trying to kick down while their arms are pulling down." His solution is to not kick at all, just let the legs drag and follow the hips, and add the timing of the kick later. I agree that when done right butterfly (like all strokes) should feel as smooth as silk. And timing is everything! Far more critical than all the other strokes combined probably, especially for looking (and feeling) even halfway presentable when you do it. One bit I recall seeing somewhere recently is that authorities (coaches) will often differ on opinion on certain aspects of swimming technique, but when the majority of them agree on the same item, then you can pretty well bet that it is important, and worth further scrutiny. You will just need to glean through all the opinions, try stuff for yourself (like keeping the hips up), and decide what works best for you. When I began earnestly practicing butterfly I was told I needed a good kick (which is true), and that I'd get a nice set of six-pack abs (I'm still waiting for that, but I'm starting to feel it). But the paradox is that it was not until I quit trying to kick that I was able to develop a good rhythm (as coach Baker, and others, confirm). As my conditioning developed and I was able to stay more horizontal (as opposed to tiring and slipping into the vertical butter-struggle), I slowly began to develop the right kick, along with that "core" strength and "undulating" movement you hear so much about (that seems so elusive till you get it). With Butterfly you will know when you hit it. It is quite the revealing moment of clarity. Of course then the task is then to be able to maintain that moment. (Practice, study, practice, study, practice, practice, etc.) I have a ways to go before I sign up for the 200 fly, but I'm thinking I can see it now on the horizon. I'm 6'2", 185#, and 46y/o... I've been practicing fly now for about 2 years, and I'm able to knock off 50's without much effort. I'm really enjoying it now, especially those first few 50's. But when I really learn is when I start to get tired and can still maintain my form (for me it takes a lot of concentration). I agree 100% that when you start to fall apart you need to quit, or switch to something else (another stroke, kick drills on your back, etc.). I've never used any props (fins, kick board, etc.), but umpty-ump number of swimmers can't be wrong, so I'm sure they will help shorten the learning curve. But I'm no expert either. expert \`ek-spert\ n - "x" = the unknown factor, "spurt" = a drip under pressure. :-) One thing I've been focusing on recently that really seems to help, especially when I feel fatigue starting to creep in, is to really stretch out where you can put some glide into your stroke. Open the chest really wide with the arms fully extended (you should feel a really good stretch along your sides, almost into your lats), pulling your elbows back behind you (up towards the surface). It helps to have some forward motion (as described in the slipping action getting from under the water over your back). I can get a longer pull this way, which makes it easier to generate the thrust to grab that breath. I can be almost at a standstill and still keep fairly decent form with this method when I start getting tired. Momentum certainly does help though. When I do this well rested, and keeping my hips up (legs trailing behind), the stroke really flows. There is little doubt to me that this sets you up for that undulating motion so often mentioned. I recall seeing a photo in Scott Rabalais' (Duck & Dive) article that illustrated this position very well. I wish I could recall which issue of SWIM Magazine it was in. Have Fun!