Some breaststroke is not legal freestyle?

Wayne, since you are clearly up on your rules, do you concur that submerging while breaststroking in a freestyle heat is illegal? I remember you talking about swimming breaststroke in freestyle heats in another thread which makes me wonder.

Originally posted by Phil Arcuni Third least favorite - In the IM, the freestyle is any stroke other than the first three. Why should that be? Why not swim your fastest stroke? Or, if I swim breastroke illegally (say, dolphin off my turn) does that mean I can swim it during the freestyle leg? Pure conjecture but the French phrase for Individual Medley translates to English as roughly four strokes, so the original intent may have been the four stroke event, so repeating one of the three required strokes would make it three strokes instead of four. Like I said, pure conjecture. It's interesting to hear that people have actually been disqualified for swimming legal breaststroke as freestyle. Someone should propose a rule change. I bet it was an oversight that they didn't change the freestyle rules when they changed the breaststroke rules.

Regarding the 15 meter rule, in free, back and fly you must surface before 15 meters. Not one breaststroker in the 2004 Olympics exceeded even 13 meters off the turns, and I could not find one example of any exceeding 14.5 meters off the start. These are the best trained and best technique in the world. The IM rule basically states fly, back, ***, and something other than the previous three strokes. So you can't do *** or fly again. Being the typical "crazy" breaststroker, I have successfully done 25 yards dolphin kick, coming up to the surface just before the 15 meters mark. Then I did double armed elementary backstroke with breaststroke kick, followed by 16 meters underwater breaststroke, and then sidestroke. And I did not get disqualified. The meet officials all did comment " was this a test" and "I bet you thought we would err and Dq you". We are fortunate to have great officials, and I make sure they have copies of the USMS rules each year! Now in 2006 when the Worlds will be in the USA, I will do 200 meters butterfly, all with breaststroke kick, just because I can and not get disqualified! I just hpe I can make the qualifyng time by kick alone. I should be able to kick a 3:20 or better if in shape. Getting old, I used to kick 2:50 for short course meters. The USMS rules are different from FINA and require a arm pull with every breaststroke kick:p

It is in fact possible to be DQ'd in freestyle while swimming what would be a legal breaststroke in a breaststroke race. By violating a fundamental premise of swimming (that freestyle is any stroke you want) it is my number one least favorite stroke and turn rule. Last year I swam a 200 free, while the fellow next to me swam a 200 IM. He was DQ'd because of submerging during breaststroke. Second least favorite - the no glide during a backstoke turn. Third least favorite - In the IM, the freestyle is any stroke other than the first three. Why should that be? Why not swim your fastest stroke? Or, if I swim breastroke illegally (say, dolphin off my turn) does that mean I can swim it during the freestyle leg?

The lane lines should have a colored mark at the the 15 meter point from both walls.

I'm on top of the rules also, and double-arm elementary backstroke with a breastroke kick is backstroke - you would not get disqualified swimming it in a backstroke event. Lousy rule. How much of the last fourth of an IM event, swum in a legal ***, back, or fly stroke, is too much and results in a dq'd? And yes Lindsay, it is definitely the case that submerging between the 15 meter marks during a freestyle event will get you disqualified. The rule is very clear.

Originally posted by Phil Arcuni And yes Lindsay, it is definitely the case that submerging between the 15 meter marks during a freestyle event will get you disqualified. The rule is very clear. Just out of interest: How do referees (or swimmers, for that matter) know where the 15 meter mark is? I have yet to be at a Masters meet where I saw any kind of 15 meter markers.

Is it still 15 meters in a 25 yard pool? If yes, does it follow that 15 meters is the case regardless of the pool size?

Originally posted by londoner62 Is it still 15 meters in a 25 yard pool? If yes, does it follow that 15 meters is the case regardless of the pool size? Yes. And yes.

1) In a 15 meters, I think equals 12.5 feet? or vice-aversa. 2) I think that the history is that the first IM was swam in Manchester. then other languages translated it into their own language. It could only come about when *** & fly were totally seperated. 3) Why would you want to submerge your head during a freestyle race. It wousl slow you down so much. 4) My mom used to swim all of her back stroke with a two legged kick. She learned to swim in the late 1920's. As far as I know she was never dq'ed. Should she have been?