So I joined Masters about 2-weeks ago...I am 61 years old...I essentially quit swimming in 1975 around age 16....so one year ago....I started swimming again....by myself...all freestyle...100-yard sets...first couple months I was doing 15 X 100s on the 2-minute....and I gradually increased numbers...to where recently, I was was swimming 30 or 40 X 100s, on the 2-minute...most of the time I was coming in at about 1:12 or 1:13, sometimes 1:15, then I'd have 45-second rest....then do it all over....my routine for the past 1-year would take me 60-80 minutes....plain jane, same thing everyday..... the last 100-yd of the set I would push myself, and I could usually come in under 1:05
So I joined Masters...the past 2 weeks I have been going to actual structured work-outs...a whole different ball game...wow..what a difference....I would like to enter a meet and swim the 100-yd Free and the 50-Free...off the wall I can now do 0:28 sec for a hard 50...but I need a lot of rest to recover....I can maintain 0:31 repetitive 50s...but I need time to recover because I was getting very short-of-breath quickly....yesterday afternoon, a coach noticed my breathing was off, and I was not exhaling until I started to turn my head out of the water, and thus I was not having time to take a full breath inhalation before my head would go back into the water....my breathing timing was obviously off...when I recognized this and began consciously exhaling earlier in my stroke this immediately helped my feeling of shortness of breath....it will take me awhile to unlearn my poor breathing technique that I likely repeated with all the 100s I have been doing....but I think I can get there
I have 2 questions....(1) Does the current thinking and science on breathing technique for a Masters Swimmer (or any competitive swimmer) recommend that I should be fully exhaled while my face in in the water, or is it customary for a portion of the exhalation to still be occurring while my face is turned to the side and out of the water....(2) the Underwater Dolphin Kick (UDK) had not really been discovered when I was 12-16 years of age, and nobody used it...if my emphasis is to try and focus on the 50 and 100 free....can someone my age learn the UDK and use it to improve my times....I have not timed myself off the blocks on the 100-yd short course yet....but I think I am probably at 0:57 right now, just guessing....but my goal is to go under 0:56....my biological clock is ticking away...so I would like to get this accomplished...
Could anyone who is an expert in Masters Swimming or Swimming in general and answer my two questions...(1) Should I be fully exhaled before my face comes out of the water (2) Can someone my age learn and use the UDK to improve my 50 and 100 Free times
Please no smart aleck responses....I am new to all of this and I am sincere in my questions....everybody talks about the underwater dolphin kick (which did not exist back when I was swimming)....but I have seen a couple general posts on here where people say it does not help them and the flutter kick is the way to go
Hi Tom,
Welcome back - wish you continued success as your strength and conditioning continue to improve.
You will get alot of answers to your questions. My opinions are as follows:
- Breathing: I always coach my athletes (and me) to as fully exhale as possible before turning their head to breathe. My focus has always been on exhaling instead of inhaling. In the beginning you might find it a bit awkward to exhale more than you are currently doing, so just experiment and do the best you can.
- The UDK is an individual as each swimmer. I have a very good UDK, but only use it off the start and the first wall (if that). After that, I focus on streamlining off the walls as far as possible and reducing drag and energy expenditure. At the end of the streamline, I start my flutter kick as I start my first arm pull. Some people do the UDK with too much undulation and create alot of drag which defeats the UDK purpose. Experiment and see which you like better. Using the UDK will challenge your conditioning.
A few things have changed in 45 years, but the basics are still the same. Good Luck.
Windrath
I have nothing to add to the excellent responses above, but I just wanted to say, :welcome:. I'm glad you joined us on the Forums! You will find this to be a great resource, especially when you are looking to improve your stroke. Post a video and request feedback, and some fabulous swimmers and coaches will gladly respond.
Our fellow Forumites have been my coaches by committee! I had been away from the pool for 31 years, and my only previous experience was swimming on my high school swim team that was coached by a non-swimming PE teacher who didn't know the first thing about coaching. I needed all the help I could get when I showed up here!
Stick around!
:cheerleader:
I'm happy to finally encounter someone who took a longer layoff than I did -- 32 years. :) I think you're doing extremely well, too.
Z, I'm trying to remember from your earlier posts... When did you return to swimming? I know you said it was a 32-year layoff, but when did you first return after that layoff? Was it just back in August when you joined the forums?
If so, you have had an amazing comeback! Even if you have been in longer than last August, you STILL have had an amazing comeback! I just looked up your results from that meet you were in earlier this year, and your two breaststroke races made TOP 10! Your others were close. Z, you are rocking the pool! :bow: :applaud::cheerleader:
Agree on fully exhaling underwater AND on timing a few race pace 25's with and without dolphin kick.
And- you are doing AWESOME!!!! I suspect you'll find your progress accelerate beyond your expectations with teammates and a structured workout, especially if you have a coach who gives real-time feedback (not all master's coaches do this). Keep your shoulders healthy and start doing some meets!!!
Tom,
Let me add a few more opinions about UDK to answer to your question about helping your 50 & 100 freestyle and you can experiment as JSC suggested.
To state the obvious - for the UDK to be effective, it should provide more propulsion than drag. That may seem like a no brainer, but you would be amazed at how many swimmers UDK off walls and are going no where. If you dolphin kick with a board and don't go very fast, there is a good chance your UDK will not benefit your race.
The key to good UDK is extreme streamlining from the tips of your fingers all the way through your toes - like you are being stretched on the rack. Toes are always pointed and you are kicking up and down. You want your kick to be quite small/narrow. Sometimes, it might even seem like a "body" undulation. One coach I worked with called it a "shimmer."
Then, how many UDK to do off the walls. If you can only muster one, I don't think it is worth the energy expenditure vs a really good streamline. I always feel you need to commit to at least 3 or more likely 5 or even 7. This is one reason I only do them off the start and first wall and then opt for a long streamline body undulation.
UDK sucks energy/oxygen very quickly, so you have to weigh that factor as well. I found that no matter how much underwater UDK I did, it did not make it easier in races, so I opted for other race strategies.
Will stop there and let others add onto. In the end, it is all about what works for you and not what the "experts" say you should do.
Paul
Hello Tom:
Yes, welcome back! I'm happy to finally encounter someone who took a longer layoff than I did -- 32 years. :) I think you're doing extremely well, too.
I agree with what Windrath wrote especially on breathing. I've found it excellent practice to only focus on my exhalations. My swimming body never forgets to inhale but I sometimes find myself holding my breath at the wrong moments. That is changing rapidly with this new focus.
The UDK is indeed the "fifth stroke" these days and for me the idea of doing one in breaststroke was hard to mentally get my head around. I keep thinking I'll pop up and see a stroke & turn judge DQing me. :blush: I'm still working on my UDK in general and have benefited from watching videos of some of the world's best swimmers do their underwater kicks. I've learned a lot with those & applying them in practice.
Aye, things have changed a lot over the years but I find it all good like being allowed to wear goggles in Olympic competitions. Whee!
You want your kick to be quite small/narrow.
I'd argue this varies from swimmer to swimmer. Lots of swimmers with tremendous UDKs use a pretty high amplitude kick. Michael Phelps would be a good example.
www.youtube.com/watch
I think you're going to need very good hip flexibility to be able to use this technique, though. Experiment and see what works best for you.
I coach some swimmers to think of full exhale as the precursor to taking a full intake of air.
Ankle flex will tell you if UDK will be of use when you use it off starts and turns.
Welcome to many varied opinions -mostly good but, try each to see if they work for you.
Welcome back to the pool! I returned to the pool almost 4 years ago after a 36 year layoff. The only thing I did differently was to keep good technique and stay away from pool injuries. This was a slow approach but it worked for me. I know I could not do what you did as far as the times you were averaging when I came back to the pool. I could not make it past 500 yards my first day back. Listen to your coach so you can continue to improve.
With respect to under water dolphin kick, it is good to train but for a 50 it doesn't matter a lot. With only a few exceptions, even world class athletes will surface very quickly (Caeleb Dressel being an exception). Look at this 50 SCM freestyle world record and how fast everyone surfaces: www.youtube.com/watch
However they all are doing dolphin kick when under water. If you can get your coach to time you to 15y you can see how dolphin vs flutter kick compares.
