New masters swim coach with different philosophy.

change is good for Masters swimmers.Just look at how Geek has embraced his Hello Kitty avatar.

As an actual Masters coach and not someone marketing a product, change is good for Masters swimmers. Coaches or businesses are ultimately responsible for the safety and satisfaction of their swimmers and of preserving harmony within the team. As I mentioned in my previous posts, we need to go back to the original message in this thread. This is someone who did not voice their concerns as objection to change for its own sake, but rather to a type of change that made him feel uncomfortable and at risk for injury, being asked to perform sets that were not at his level. Showering any individual, whether an age-grouper or a Masters swimmer, with abusive comments ("I would say you are a wimp and need to suck it up") in response to their discomfort is beyond irresponsible. I also take issue with aztimm and his years-long diatribe about how few USMS members compete. That is a pure fallacy. While only 1/3 may do swim meets a significantly higher percentage may do swim meet, running races, triathlons, etc. On the huge team I am a member of I'd say probably less than 10% are total non-competitors, in anything. I'll refer you to the USMS website: "About 25 percent of our nearly 60,000 members enter pool or open water competitions. The greater percentage of USMS members does not compete." There is no doubt that change is good and should absolutely be encouraged. No one disputes that. But any change needs to be gradual, and respectful to the swimmers. What is considered to be "good change" depends upon the individual and in Masters swimming, participants deserve to have the independence to make decisions on their own. They should not be ridiculed or dismissed for their choices.

I'll refer you to the USMS website: "About 25 percent of our nearly 60,000 members enter pool or open water competitions. The greater percentage of USMS members does not compete." Aren't those just USMS figures about participation in USMS-sanctioned meets? Geek specifically mentioned triathletes and runners. The local YMCA's masters program (not USMS-affiliated) is basically nothing but triathletes. I my earlier years with USMS, I knew people on at least the Northwestern masters team (USMS-affiliated at that time) who were very serious triathletes. I don't think most of them swam USMS meets.

Just look at how Geek has embraced his Hello Kitty avatar. And, look how YOU have embraced my BLUE COMIC SANS font! :bliss:

Showering any individual, whether an age-grouper or a Masters swimmer, with abusive comments in response to their discomfort is beyond irresponsible. Yay, multi-quotes. Abusive is 400 IMs on short rest or any form of a kick set. Irresponsible is holding yourself out as a Master's coach without any team. They should not be ridiculed or dismissed for their choices. Have you ever been to a Master's workout? I don't know what I would do if I wasn't ridiculed or dismissed multiple times during a workout. I'll refer you to the USMS website: "About 25 percent of our nearly 60,000 members enter pool or open water competitions. The greater percentage of USMS members does not compete." I'll refer you to an actual Masters team. As I stated, apparently not in English, while only 25% may compete in USMS meets, Masters swimmers compete in all aspects of sports. For instance, one of the levels on our team has about 20 athletes. 90% of them did a triathlon in the past month, none did a meet. Many open water events are not USMS. What about running or tough-mudders or F3? I'd say that the reach of USMS is far beyond meets. I do appreciate the lecture on how to coach Masters swimmers. Who do you think you are, Paul Smith?

I've hesitated to chime in on this since this coach is mine too. I've been following to see what would come of this and honestly am a bit surprised about some of the comments - but good surprised. I too have been frustrated with the big changes and have tried to embrace them where I could. He's a great technique coach and is working with us to improve the minute details. For some, he's really made a huge difference - mainly those who are wanting to compete in meets and are looking for the different stroke work. For those of us who are distance, OW, or fitness swimmers, the new coach hasn't seemed as good of a fit. I can't tell you how many workouts are about all-out speed. Most are very short distances which don't help those of us going any longer than a 200 (his longest distance in a set). And many of the sets are all done on the same interval so all of us are supposed to keep up. For those who are faster and can do 100 just over a minute, they get a lot of rest, even at high speed. For those of us who are at the tail end of making the intervals, it becomes a fight for survival - the stroke gets sloppy; form is negated for just making it, and to be honest, motivation is lost. It's just not fun to show up as much anymore. I'm a competitive swimmer, but just feel like I'm fighting a losing battle. Yes, we need to each talk to him to really understand what it is he's trying to accomplish, though. I think he's getting good changes out of those on the team at the top level, again. But for many of us who aren't the top speedsters, the workouts are just too much and are taking the fun out of what Master's swimming should be.

I don't know anything about this coach but I would hate doing long-rest speed work all the time. Swimming is much more about staying sane while raising kids and balancing work and family than it is about competing for me. There's nothing like a chunky and challenging distance free or IM set to enter that peaceful, zen-like world where the mind is fully engaged with the particulars of the set to escape the worries of the day. I feel for you guys...

I don't know anything about this coach but I would hate doing long-rest speed work all the time. Swimming is much more about staying sane while raising kids and balancing work and family than it is about competing for me. There's nothing like a chunky and challenging distance free or IM set to enter that peaceful, zen-like world where the mind is fully engaged with the particulars of the set to escape the worries of the day. I feel for you guys... +1! Your post resonated with me. I am a breaststroker (like you) and compete in all three breaststroke events; so, I need to do those Fortress-style all out sets with long rest. On the other hand, I also LOVE competing in the Georgia Games Open Water Swim and racing the 3K & 1K back-to-back. I absolutely love racing open water and those training days were I do a "time trial" 3K race in the pool. That "zen-like world" you describe is exactly what I thoroughly enjoy. Variety is the spice of life in swimming, too! :wiggle:

Here's the bottom line. Nothing kills a swim team more than locker room/social media complaining. This whine session will get back to your coach most likely and he/she will be stung. Most coaches, especially those who coach Masters, do it for the love of the sport and their athletes. Seeing whining on the internet as opposed to an adult conversation is destructive to the team. Your coach wants to do a good job and would likely appreciate a conversation. Masters coaching is as much art as science as each swimmer has their own agenda. Some want balls hard workouts every day while others want to piddle around in fins and pull gear.

I've hesitated to chime in on this since this coach is mine too. I've been following to see what would come of this and honestly am a bit surprised about some of the comments - but good surprised. I too have been frustrated with the big changes and have tried to embrace them where I could. He's a great technique coach and is working with us to improve the minute details. For some, he's really made a huge difference - mainly those who are wanting to compete in meets and are looking for the different stroke work. For those of us who are distance, OW, or fitness swimmers, the new coach hasn't seemed as good of a fit. I can't tell you how many workouts are about all-out speed. Most are very short distances which don't help those of us going any longer than a 200 (his longest distance in a set). And many of the sets are all done on the same interval so all of us are supposed to keep up. For those who are faster and can do 100 just over a minute, they get a lot of rest, even at high speed. For those of us who are at the tail end of making the intervals, it becomes a fight for survival - the stroke gets sloppy; form is negated for just making it, and to be honest, motivation is lost. It's just not fun to show up as much anymore. I'm a competitive swimmer, but just feel like I'm fighting a losing battle. Yes, we need to each talk to him to really understand what it is he's trying to accomplish, though. I think he's getting good changes out of those on the team at the top level, again. But for many of us who aren't the top speedsters, the workouts are just too much and are taking the fun out of what Master's swimming should be. Any coach should address the needs of all his swimmers, not just the subset of fast swimmers or sprinters or whatnot. I do believe there is pretty good evidence that one can improve aerobic conditioning with high-intensity efforts, though. Truth be told, though, if one is (for example) interested in longer OW swims it is hard for me to see how a diet of ONLY short reps at high intensity can be the best thing. Here's the bottom line. Nothing kills a swim team more than locker room/social media complaining. This whine session will get back to your coach most likely and he/she will be stung. Most coaches, especially those who coach Masters, do it for the love of the sport and their athletes. Seeing whining on the internet as opposed to an adult conversation is destructive to the team. Your coach wants to do a good job and would likely appreciate a conversation. Good post (i added emphasis). Though I don't think the OP was trying to start a whining session but to get honest feedback.