After being "spoken to" by the lifeguards about training SDKs, I am wondering how dangerous it really is to do multiple full 25 SCY SDKs.
Consider this set:
Fins on.
10x/2:00
This is just an example. Basically I'm referring to any set that contains multiple full 25 SDKs on a fixed time interval.
I've seen multiple people post sets like this in their blogs.
I've heard that on some age group teams the coach will demand that swimmers complete N full 25 SDKs on some fixed interval or everyone does it over.
The above observations would suggest that training full 25 SCY SDKs is a reasonable thing to do, but I've talked to some coaches and guards who seem to genuinely believe that even going past mid-pool underwater is just asking for trouble.
For a reasonably fit masters or age-group swimmer (Let's say a "BB" or stronger swimmer between the ages of 10 and 70 who can comfortably train 4x1hr/week), what do you think:
-Sets like these are generally safe as long as you don't do something stupid, like intentionally hyperventilate to the point of making yourself light headed before your push-off.
-Sets like this are generally safe, but you can never know if you have an un-diagnosed medical condition that renders them very dangerous so you shouldn't do them.
-Such sets are a little risky, but it's a risk you have to take to get really good at SDKs.
-If you do this kind of training regularly, you will eventually pass out under water and possibly die.
-The modern world is sufficiently rampant with litigation that no one can admit that sets like these are safe, even as anonymous vote on this forum.
karl,
underwaters are highly personal.
some can do them with ease and others cannot.
my only recommendation is do what you are comfortable doing and dont take stupid risks. (and by you i mean the swimming community).
dont push others to try and make it if they simply cannot.
even on breath control sets. do what you can do and dont push others.
as an example, i can make 25s pretty easy (thanks mark and those firestone 500s we did in the dive tank) and breath sets have no issue taking 1 breath for a 50. one guy on my team, we'll call him tom, cannot do that. so even though the written set says take only 3. i take just 1 and he gets my extra 2. i am safe and tom is safe. both doing what we can safely do.
steve
p.s. and yes i have pushed myself in the past (and also as a masters) on how far i can go. but ive never thought i was in danger. however i wasnt so stupid to think i could make it past the turn at the 75 all under either!
I believe 25s underwater are reasonably safe for a proficient swimmer.If they are taking less than 20 sec and you haven't hyperventilated you should be well within safe parameters.Past 25s,or with slower swimmers I think one wold be pushing there luck.Also,if you are underwater and feel the urge to breathe,don't fight it,come up and breathe.
karl,
underwaters are highly personal.
some can do them with ease and others cannot.
I think this is really the key. Pool staff hate people doing underwaters because they really don't know who knows what they're doing and who could potential push it too far.
After being "spoken to" by the lifeguards about training SDKs, I am wondering how dangerous it really is to do multiple full 25 SCY SDKs.According to experts shallow water blackout is the #1 cause of swimming related deaths in physically fit swimmers. So if death is on the "dangerous" side of the ledger, then yes, SDK 25’s can be dangerous.
shallowwaterblackoutprevention.org/
According to experts shallow water blackout is the #1 cause of swimming related deaths in physically fit swimmers. So if death is on the "dangerous" side of the ledger, then yes, SDK 25’s can be dangerous.
shallowwaterblackoutprevention.org/
The web site does not assign a time to 'prolonged.' I do a few different underwater 25s sets, the slowest of which takes 22 sec, and the fastest of which takes16 or so.
Dangerous?
I know I coach with a "breathe when you need to" policy because I really don't want to have to get in to rescue you! Each person has their own tolerance level. I consider all my swimmers alive and breathing a good thing... :)
Coached breath control sets can be more safe with other people in your lane who will notice if something is wrong in a fraction of a minute. Fast 25 SDKs with fins that are completed in less than 15 seconds on 30+ seconds rest I think are as safe as any set. 25s and further distances that take someone a lot longer are probably less safe. Saying going past half way is asking for trouble I think is ridiculous for the vast majority of masters swimmers.
Thanks for the thoughtful replies.
sunruh writes:
... do what you are comfortable doing... yes i have pushed myself in the past (and also as a masters) on how far i can go. but ive never thought i was in danger. however i wasnt so stupid to think i could make it past the turn at the 75 all under either!
When I was in HS the PE teacher had a (probably ill-advised) "let's see who can swim the farthest under water" contest. As a long time age-group and HS swimmer I knew 25 was easy. Most kids weren't making it 25 so I figured winning would be easy. Then, total surprise, some kid, NOT on the swim team, NOT super-jock, did 50 SCY. As a swim team member I knew I could not let that stand. I did a 50, turned under water, pushed off and came up just past the flags. A couple of times I felt my diaphragm "jump". I started to get tunnel vision and I was slightly convulsing at the end. It scared the $%#& out of me. For years after that I would not even attempt a 25, not even a no-breather on the surface. When I do 25s SDKs now, they aren't comfortable, but I don't feel anything like I did that day in HS. I'm figure I'm quite safe. With all the hysteria about this today, now I'm wondering if I am kidding myself.
BTW, fins off I am taking ~26s. fins on I'm taking about 17s. I get ~45s rest on the set mentioned in the OP.
Since the longest you can stay underwater in a (non-breaststroke) race is 15 meters, does it really make a lot of sense to do underwater 25s?
By the way, my team does underwater 25 kicks and I hate them. :)
You're doing SDKs with FINS.
You're not holding your breath for that long and you're resting after each effort.
What's the big deal?
Sounds like the guards don't want to:
+ have to rescue you,
+ get out of their chairs, or
+ write a report.
